Maybe I Should Have Read The Fine Print? What To Do?

[MeLoveBeer]

Okay, so having produced my first successful AG brew 2 weeks ago (80% efficiency which I'm stoked with), I thought I'd have a crack at Tony's Little Creatures Bright Ale Clone. I had a look at the recipe in the recipeDB, ordered the ingredients from G&G (all grains crushed and in a single bag) and then realised that I've done something really stupid...

I should have realised at the time I ordered, but I didn't check the target volume for the recipe and have ordered enough for a 52 litre brew (despite only having a 38 litre mash tun).

Now my questions are as follows:

Am I best to divide the crushed grain bill in half (keeping in mind that I can't guarantee a consistent mix of ingredients), mash and then combine the results of the two mashes? (meaning that the resulting liquid from the first mash is exposed and vulnerable to infection for as long as it takes me to complete the second mash). I have a 66 litre kettle, so can handle the pre-boil volume quite okay.

Given that I'm fly sparging (and have a 35 litre HLT), could I possibly get away with mashing the whole lot in 1 go? Its a 10.2kg grain bill and I'm not sure about the amount of displacement that the grain would cause.

 

[flattop]

a couple of suggestions... no direct answers

one idea would be to cast around for someone local that has a bigger rig.... size sometimes matters..

another idea would be to get a couple of no chill cubes and make 2 batches, no chill each one (they can be stored for months that way) and when it comes to fermenting time (assuming you have 2 fermenters) pour half a cube in each fermenter (blend the 2 batches to offset the difference).

 

[Stuster]

Yep, you'll be able to mash that much in a 38L cooler. I have a 36L one and have done 10kg. It's a squeeze but it works. I'd suggest a 2.5:1 water to grain ratio, then you should be fine with the sparge. You'll be close to the limit with your kettle. You could even put aside 3-5L and add that during the boil. Just watch it like a hawk as it gets up to the boil or you'll have a boil over in no time.

 

[MeLoveBeer]

Yep, you'll be able to mash that much in a 38L cooler. I have a 36L one and have done 10kg. It's a squeeze but it works. I'd suggest a 2.5:1 water to grain ratio, then you should be fine with the sparge. You'll be close to the limit with your kettle. You could even put aside 3-5L and add that during the boil. Just watch it like a hawk as it gets up to the boil or you'll have a boil over in no time.

I'd be wrapped if I could get away with it Stuster

@flattop, I'm more concerned about handling the volume pre boil (I no chill for all my brews and have more than enough fermenters to deal with primary and secondary for the volume)

Does anyone have a formula for calculating/estimating grain displacement in mash tuns?

 

[davewaldo]

Here is a great link for Mash calculations incudling a calculator for maximum grain for a given tun http://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml

I also have a 38L mash tun and have regularly make double batches with 10kg of grain.

Go for it! What size boil kettle do you have?

EDIT: I have noticed that the calculator is a bit optimistic, but a good guide. It says you will easily be able to mash in a 38L tun

 

[crozdog]

don't forget you can always do multiple sparges sparges to get your volume or just do two batch sparges.

OR

do a partigyle & use the first runnings for a big beer & 2nd runnings for a smaller beer - means 2 boils but. you could run the 2nd runnings into cubes while you boiled the first runnings. do the 2nd boil straight after the 1st 7 watch your volumes. with equal size runnings you'll get about 60% of your extract in the 1st runnings & 40% in the 2nd.

 

[MeLoveBeer]

Here is a great link for Mash calculations incudling a calculator for maximum grain for a given tun http://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml

I also have a 38L mash tun and have regularly make double batches with 10kg of grain.

Go for it! What size boil kettle do you have?

EDIT: I have noticed that the calculator is a bit optimistic, but a good guide. It says you will easily be able to mash in a 38L tun

Not a bad collection of calculators Dave (you're right though, very optimistic calcs). My boil kettle is a 66 litre SS pot, so should be able to handle the volume. Good to hear that someone else is using a similar setup for double batches successfully.

you could run the 2nd runnings into cubes while you boiled the first runnings.

Crozdog, have you had much success doing this? I've been wary because of the lower temp for runnings compared to post-boil when it pasturises the cube

 

[barls]

i got a 40L mash tun and a 70L and i do double batches most times with the most ive done being 13kg.

 

[Thirsty Boy]

adding 1 KG to a volume of water will add just about 0.66L to the total volume.

So if you have a 10kg grain bill, and 30L of strike water... your total mash volume would be pretty close to 36.66L - so you could squeak in even as much as a 3:1 L:G ratio in your mash tun... 2.5:1 would be safer though.

Multiple run-off batch sparge or continuous sparge and you'll do a 10kg grist for a double batch without a hiccup.

TB

 

[crozdog]

Not a bad collection of calculators Dave (you're right though, very optimistic calcs). My boil kettle is a 66 litre SS pot, so should be able to handle the volume. Good to hear that someone else is using a similar setup for double batches successfully.



Crozdog, have you had much success doing this? I've been wary because of the lower temp for runnings compared to post-boil when it pasturises the cube

I don't do that cause I have plenty of kettle capacity. I am not suggesting you leave it in the cube for long, just while you do the first boil if you decide to partigyle

 

[Steve]

I regularly do 10kg batches in my 38 litre mash tun. No probs. Batch sparge.

 

[Lemon]

Coming at the problem from a different angle.

If you get a large sheet of plastic, say 1.5m square and lay it on the floor, put the pile of grain in the centre. You can mix the material by liftng each corner in turn towards its diagonal opposite, so that the pile folds into itself.

I have used this method to mix crushed minerals in order to get a homogeneous mix and I think it is appropriate for mixing grain.

Then split the, hopefully, mixed grain as many ways as you need. This can be done by splitting the conical pile vertically with a piece of thin board.

As I said, another angle.

Lemon

 

[MeLoveBeer]

Can someone possibly check my math?

6.7 litres (estimated displacement of 10.2 litre grain bill)
25.5 litres (strike water at 2.5:1 ratio)

Total initial capacity required = 32.2 litres

That part is fine, however the issue I see is hitting the temp of 75.6 degrees before fly sparging. Beer smith tells me that I'm going to require a whopping 14.9 litres of water to raise the mash temp so...

6.7 litres (estimated displacement of 10.2 litre grain bill)
25.5 litres (strike water at 2.5:1 ratio)
14.9 litres (water for raising temp to 75.6 degrees)

Actual Total capacity required = 47.1 litres

Am I missing something, or is this just not going to fit?