Carbing/Conditioning in a Cube before keg

[S.E]

here you go something thats actually designed to take pressure exploding
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ahp6rBs5aQ
look at the fragments. its not going to be pretty when it happens and someone is next to it.

Barls, please rest assured that cubes are perfectly safe for cask conditioning ale. They will not take anything like the pressure of the bottle in your video before they split or pop the tap and that’s what makes them safer than bottles.

Home brewers in the UK have been using semi rigid cubes and even collapsible polypins since the sixties without fatalities. Here in the Illawarra a lot of brewers I know have been using cubes for cask conditioning for at least 5 years. Brewers all over Australia are using cubes for no chill, I have heard of no chill cubes spontaneously fermenting but never exploding.

When Jesus was teaching the trappist monks to brew they didn’t say “oh dear lord have you pressure tested these bottles” they just got on with it without saying a word.

Go on Barls give it a go, you know you want to. If it makes you feel better you could always throw a towel over the cube like bottlers are advised to do.

Cheers

 

[fletcher]

When Jesus was teaching the trappist monks to brew they didn’t say “oh dear lord have you pressure tested these bottles” they just got on with it without saying a word.

please tell me you're taking the piss here.

 

[S.E]

please tell me you're taking the piss here.

It was meant as a joke, Trappist Monks and the vow of silence thing not saying a word. It seemed funny at the time. Sorry

 

[mje1980]

Dont worry sean, i have access to hydraulic relief valves, most set to 350bar. Ill fit them to your cubes at stout fest.

 

[fletcher]

It was meant as a joke, Trappist Monks and the vow of silence thing not saying a word. It seemed funny at the time. Sorry

haha nah you're fine mate. made me laugh, but because i thought you were being serious haha

 

[manticle]

I think the phrase 'when Jesus taught the trappist monks...' should have made you cotton on Fletch.

 

[fletcher]

that's what it was. i thought...'he thinks that!? better back away here...jesus freak'

 

[S.E]

that's what it was. i thought...'he thinks that!? better back away here...jesus freak'

I’m glad you asked the question and that was cleared up.

 

[fletcher]

I’m glad you asked the question and that was cleared up.

i realise i've just wasted lots of pixels and megabytes (and time) on my lame posts

 

[S.E]

Dont worry sean, i have access to hydraulic relief valves, most set to 350bar. Ill fit them to your cubes at stout fest.

Mark do you have access to a compressor? I have one but the pressure gauge is broken. I think blowing up a cube would be a great project for stout fest.

This thread was linked in the recent posts this morning. http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/873-carbonation-cap/ According to post 10 PET bottles can go to 100 psi without bursting so it’s not surprising they can explode with such ferocity. I don’t think a cube will be any way near as exciting but we had best do it after we have all had a few beer so we are immune to danger just in case.

Although we have established that cubes have been tested in use and can clearly take the pressure of carbonation safely it would be rather interesting to see how much pressure they would take before splitting.

I remember someone turned up to one of our early real ale fests with a cube that had swollen up so much it was starting to split down one side was that you Mark or do you remember who it was?

 

[mje1980]

No i dont have one sean. hmmm would be a good experiment. Yes i remember, it stretched in one place. Was quite odd but it still served many ales from hazy memory. Definately didnt blow up

 

[S.E]

Thought I would update this thread with the results of a carbing and conditioning in a cube experiment I tried.

The idea was to see if I could ferment then carb, condition and dispense all in the same cube.
I filled the cube leaving no head space and fermented with the cube on its side and a blow off tube fitted to the tap like this.




I was hoping that with no head space a lot of trub and yeast would be blown out, It sort of worked but not as well as I had hoped.

When It finished fermenting I closed the tap removed the blow off and turned the cube the right way up.
I didn’t open or prime the cube, the yeast that had settled on the side when it had been the bottom slid down and was roused enough to ferment a bit more to carb and swell the cube like so.



The resulting beer was fantastic the hop aroma and taste was intense. This was part of a 55 litre batch and I fermented the rest in my 60L fermenter. The beer in the fermenter was nice but didn’t have anything near the hop aroma and taste of the cube especially after it had been casked (in a cube of course).

So what I’m thinking is there could be several good reasons to ferment in a cube then carb and condition in it before kegging.

1) If you no chill there is no need to clean and sanitise a fermenter.
2) The secondary pressure ferment and carbonation in the cube will aid and speed up flocculation/Clarification.
3) it will be pre carbed before kegging so save co2.
4) Improved hop taste and aroma?

I had intended to try this again to see if there was still such a noticeable difference before posting but just haven’t got around to doing so. I know others on here ferment in cubes so would be interested to hear if anyone has sealed and carbed and if so noticed any hop improvement.

Cheers Sean

 

[S.E]

DOH! It’s just occurred to me that I ran the whole batch through my chiller but can’t remember if I filled the fermenter or cube first so the noticeable hop difference may be simply because the cube was chilled quicker and nothing to do with it being sealed and carbed.

 

[takai]

Anyone experimented with room temperature cube conditioning before kegging? Im considering it as i dont have a conditioning fridge (damn you dodgy garage electrics) and need more space for beer

 

[manticle]

Experienced as in done it? Yes. Any particular bit of info you are chasing?

 

[takai]

Anything to watch out for? I presume at ambient temp it will bulge a bit from the residual fermentation, but i plan to just rack over and use it as a longer term secondary. Thinking about putting a little purge port in the cap to purge the headspace with CO2, but thats about it.

 

[Eagleburger]

Anything to watch out for? I presume at ambient temp it will bulge a bit from the residual fermentation, but i plan to just rack over and use it as a longer term secondary. Thinking about putting a little purge port in the cap to purge the headspace with CO2, but thats about it.

Just wear appropriate PPE in its vicinity and you will be alright.

Photos dont do this justice. It was an english ale I did last year for christmas. It was naturally carbed in a 50L keg.I took 1/2 to a party and so I could leave lite, I put it in a cube. It was filled to the brim to exclude oxygen. The car ride turned it into a balloon.

 

[S.E]

After about seven years of trusty service, it finally happened. I let one of my cubes swell a little too much and it burst.

Well it didn’t burst exactly it just sort of split and started leaking slightly. A bit of a disappointment and letdown actually, after the destruction and devastation that had been predicted.

I didn’t have room in the Cuberator so had left it on the utility floor at ambient. I noticed the day before that it had swollen a bit more than usual but got sidetracked and forgot to release the pressure.

First I noticed a small puddle on the floor near the cube, and then saw a stream of beer squirting from a pin hole in the cube.



Turning the cube on its side revealed a gash near the bottom but it hadn’t split all the way through, just a tiny pin hole. So I turned the tap uppermost and opening it to release pressure.



And repaired the hole with duct tape.



So all’s well that ends well. The beer was saved and I should get another seven years use from the cube. After all, they do repair holes in passenger planes with duct tape don’t they!!

 

[antiphile]

After all, they do repair holes in passenger planes with duct tape don’t they!!

Yeah, I'm pretty sure you're right. I could swear I've seen it on the tellie on a show called Air Crash Investigation.

 

[S.E]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure you're right. I could swear I've seen it on the tellie on a show called Air Crash Investigation.

It’s not really duct tape that they use to patch up planes but looks the same.

[SIZE=11pt]It wouldn’t inspire confidence if you looked out the window and saw someone taping the engine on your plane just before takeoff like the passenger in this article did, would it? [/SIZE]