Braumeister - Tips & Tricks

[Batz]

I brew a little differently on my 50lt BM, I set beersmith for my finished volume which will be 55lt (or at least I use the 55lt BM measure groove). I then brew and sparge as usual, then after boil I top up from an urn to the 55lt groove. I rarely miss my expected OG by more than a point or two. Here I whirlpool and chill or no-chill as normal.

After the trub left in the BM (not much I have a pick up tube), and trub left in two fermenters, I keg two 19lt kegs and one 9lt party keg.

It's the way I have brewed with my BM since I have owned it, and that's a couple of years now.

Batz

 

[dicko]

I am probably a bit of a fanatic when it comes to Beersmith calcs.

I calculate the EXACT amount of water needed and that is all I use.

I mash with 25 litres and I sparge the rest through the grain after the mash.

I have my grain absorption and boil off figures set exactly for my grain crush and my BM...do not go on the default figure for grain absorption in Beersmith unless you have measured it and found it to be correct for your crush of your mill.

I only work on "mash" efficiency as "brewhouse" efficiency can and will vary from brew to brew depending on your losses in the kettle and the fermenter.

I have a 20 litre BM and I don't use a pick up tube but I have my Beersmith set to achieve a Batch volume of 25 litres.

I chill with an immersion chiller and then remove the chiller and whirlpool and allow the wort to settle for ONE HOUR in the kettle with the lid on before running it into the fermenter.

I tilt the BM to get 20 litres into the fermenter or if no trub is coming out I continue to drain on an angle until the first lot of trub starts to reach the tap outlet.. when this happens I stop draining. I am usually left with approx 4 litres in the kettle which is break material and hop trub.

I always get between 20 and 21 litres into the fermenter which will give me 19 litres into the keg. The wort is crystal clear.

Here is my equipment profile for a 90 min boil



Here is a dipstick I made to achieve the exact volume of water required as per Beersmith calculations



Here is my grain absorption settings in "Advanced Options" in Beersmith



My figure for grain absorption will differ from others...This figure however, needs to be accurate if you are to achieve repeatability.
I feel that the reason some claim that the BM loses efficiency as the beers get "bigger" is because the grain absorption figure is not correct and this results in a wort that is more diluted than it should be as the volume of grain increases.. This of course is if the absorption figure in Beersmith is higher than what it actually is in real life.
A good starting point in Beersmith for a BM is if you select the BIAB in the mash profile and work on that absorption figure which is lower than the other default.

For some time I had no other BM users to compare notes with and I couldn't seem to get any reliable figures from people that I had asked so I just relied on my own personal observations.
There is now a couple more BM owners in my area and we have come to realise that these figures vary particularly with grain crush.
I have a 3 roller Crankenstein and have it set to 1.4mm and get an efficiency of 77%. The other guys have two roller mills set to 1.2 and are getting up around 85% so I will be experimenting with my mill over the next few brews..not that I am all that worried about a few point of efficiency.

BTW the other guys "grain absorption" figures are higher than mine.
We all have 20 litre BM's and the boil off figures are very close from our recent results.

All the above are based on my observations and thoughts and is by no means "gospel" on BM brewing as each brewers situations are different.

I hope this PP type post may help some newbs with the BM :lol:

Cheers

Edted; Immersion chiller not CFWC

 

[djar007]

That over the side measuring idea is great Dicko. Consider it stolen. I have been trying to work out a good way to measure two different volumes. The one with the malt pipe in and the one with it out. Your idea is neat and perfect for me. Mind if I steal that one before you patent it?

 

[danestead]

What he said!

I am probably a bit of a fanatic when it comes to Beersmith calcs.

I calculate the EXACT amount of water needed and that is all I use.

I mash with 25 litres and I sparge the rest through the grain after the mash.

I have my grain absorption and boil off figures set exactly for my grain crush and my BM...do not go on the default figure for grain absorption in Beersmith unless you have measured it and found it to be correct for your crush of your mill.

I only work on "mash" efficiency as "brewhouse" efficiency can and will vary from brew to brew depending on your losses in the kettle and the fermenter.

I have a 20 litre BM and I don't use a pick up tube but I have my Beersmith set to achieve a Batch volume of 25 litres.

I chill with an immersion chiller and then remove the chiller and whirlpool and allow the wort to settle for ONE HOUR in the kettle with the lid on before running it into the fermenter.

I tilt the BM to get 20 litres into the fermenter or if no trub is coming out I continue to drain on an angle until the first lot of trub starts to reach the tap outlet.. when this happens I stop draining. I am usually left with approx 4 litres in the kettle which is break material and hop trub.

I always get between 20 and 21 litres into the fermenter which will give me 19 litres into the keg. The wort is crystal clear.

Here is my equipment profile for a 90 min boil

Equipment Profile 20 L BM 90 min boil.jpg

Here is a dipstick I made to achieve the exact volume of water required as per Beersmith calculations

BM Dip Stick.jpg

IMG_0569.jpg

Here is my grain absorption settings in "Advanced Options" in Beersmith

Beersmith Advanced Options Dicko's BM.JPG

My figure for grain absorption will differ from others...This figure however, needs to be accurate if you are to achieve repeatability.
I feel that the reason some claim that the BM loses efficiency as the beers get "bigger" is because the grain absorption figure is not correct and this results in a wort that is more diluted than it should be as the volume of grain increases.. This of course is if the absorption figure in Beersmith is higher than what it actually is in real life.
A good starting point in Beersmith for a BM is if you select the BIAB in the mash profile and work on that absorption figure which is lower than the other default.

For some time I had no other BM users to compare notes with and I couldn't seem to get any reliable figures from people that I had asked so I just relied on my own personal observations.
There is now a couple more BM owners in my area and we have come to realise that these figures vary particularly with grain crush.
I have a 3 roller Crankenstein and have it set to 1.4mm and get an efficiency of 77%. The other guys have two roller mills set to 1.2 and are getting up around 85% so I will be experimenting with my mill over the next few brews..not that I am all that worried about a few point of efficiency.

BTW the other guys "grain absorption" figures are higher than mine.
We all have 20 litre BM's and the boil off figures are very close from our recent results.

All the above are based on my observations and thoughts and is by no means "gospel" on BM brewing as each brewers situations are different.

I hope this PP type post may help some newbs with the BM :lol:

Cheers

Edted; Immersion chiller not CFWC

 

[dicko]

You go for it djar007,

It is a pain to have the only measure that comes with the BM on the centre post which restricts a lot of measuring, particularly when you are setting it up.

If I was a bit younger I would build a factory and go into manufacturing them :lol:

 

[syl]

Here's one for all you Braumeister's out there:

What utilisation % do you calculate for whirlpool hopping/hop-standing? The general consensus between brewers varies from 10-20% which is obviously a massive difference with high alpha hops!

Doing a whirlpool hop only brew this weekend, so it's going to make a big difference.

Cheers

 

[stakka82]

Matt Brynildson of Firestone Walker Brewing Company says, "The fact that there is some isomerization (about 15% in whirlpool versus 35% in the kettle) of alpha acid means that not only hop aroma and hop flavor can be achieved, but also some bittering."

http://byo.com/component/k2/item/2808-hop-stands

Exact figure will vary depending on thermal mass of kettle and at which temp you add your whirlpool hops and for how long.

Basically how long is a piece of string.... personally whirlpool at about 95 degrees for about 20 mins (50l), consider it a 10 min addition software wise and this seems right from experimenting over 10 or so brews.

 

[syl]

Matt Brynildson of Firestone Walker Brewing Company says, "The fact that there is some isomerization (about 15% in whirlpool versus 35% in the kettle) of alpha acid means that not only hop aroma and hop flavor can be achieved, but also some bittering."

http://byo.com/component/k2/item/2808-hop-stands

Exact figure will vary depending on thermal mass of kettle and at which temp you add your whirlpool hops and for how long.

Basically how long is a piece of string.... personally whirlpool at about 95 degrees for about 20 mins (50l), consider it a 10 min addition software wise and this seems right from experimenting over 10 or so brews.

Yeah. I know it was always going to be different, hence I wanted to get some feedback for our kit!

So a 10min addition would be about 10% utilisation as a guesstimate (at 1050). I am going to plan for 12% utilization to be safe as this is a low IBU beer (MG Steam Ale) and then dry hop the feck out of it!

 

[Malted]

Here is a dipstick I made to achieve the exact volume of water required as per Beersmith calculations

Excellent Stuff!

 

[DeGarre]

Where and how is this attached?

http://speidels-braumeister.de/shop/de/Zubehoer/Brauprozess/Hopfensieb

With this could I ditch the hop bag/spider and let the hops run free in the boil/kettle?

 

[lael]

I am probably a bit of a fanatic when it comes to Beersmith calcs.

I calculate the EXACT amount of water needed and that is all I use.

I mash with 25 litres and I sparge the rest through the grain after the mash.



My figure for grain absorption will differ from others...This figure however, needs to be accurate if you are to achieve repeatability.
I feel that the reason some claim that the BM loses efficiency as the beers get "bigger" is because the grain absorption figure is not correct and this results in a wort that is more diluted than it should be as the volume of grain increases.. This of course is if the absorption figure in Beersmith is higher than what it actually is in real life.
A good starting point in Beersmith for a BM is if you select the BIAB in the mash profile and work on that absorption figure which is lower than the other default.

For some time I had no other BM users to compare notes with and I couldn't seem to get any reliable figures from people that I had asked so I just relied on my own personal observations.
There is now a couple more BM owners in my area and we have come to realise that these figures vary particularly with grain crush.
I have a 3 roller Crankenstein and have it set to 1.4mm and get an efficiency of 77%. The other guys have two roller mills set to 1.2 and are getting up around 85% so I will be experimenting with my mill over the next few brews..not that I am all that worried about a few point of efficiency.

dicko - how do you calculate grain absorption?

 

[dicko]

Hi lael,

Total water needed as calculated by your software.....minus the pre boil volume actual measurement after mash is complete.... equals the grain absorption amount.

What I do with my BM is after the mash is complete I lift the malt pipe and let it drain into another pot until the wort reaches close to boiling (around 97 deg) and then I tip that volume in with the rest of the wort and that amount will equal my pre boil volume.

In Beersmith my POST boil volume is approximately 1 litre more than my batch volume as the software allows this for shrinkage after cooling the wort.
By doing the same procedure every time I brew I achieve figures which are the same and repeatable.

:icon_offtopic:
Just a bit off topic for your question but worth mentioning...

I decided to do a mash last Saturday night and I started at around 7.30 pm.
I let the mash complete and when the beeper was going off I cycled the BM program to the point where it said "lift the malt pipe" or similar and this stopped the beeping.
I left it in this condition with the malt pipe still in place and the temperature remaining at 77 deg which was my set mash out.
I then went to bed at around 10.30 and the BM held mash out temp overnight without running the pump.
I got up at 6.30 am and proceeded to lift the malt pipe, sparge and complete the boil and chill the wort.
To my amazement I found that my efficiency had gone from 77% to 87% without me doing anything else but holding the mash out temp overnite.
My normal mash out time is 15 mins...

I am mentioning this to point out that repeatability in brewing is really only achieved by using the same procedures every time.you brew.

Cheers

 

[djar007]

Interesting Dicko. Would you ever consider mashing over a twelve hour period? Not just at mash out temp but slow the whole mash down to twelve hours.

 

[dicko]

I have been lead to believe that some commercial breweries have the beta rest held for two hours to make the wort more fermentable but I have also heard that extended times at the protein rest can cause beers to suffer with head retention issues.
I don't think I would consider mashing over 12 hours by extending each mash step but I guess at our level of brewing it would not be a big cost to "try it out".
I will conduct some more testing on the mash out times over the course of my next brews and try to determine if there is a "sweet point" with time in the mash out to gain the extra points without having to leave it overnight.
I am also going to reduce the gap in my mill now I have other guys achieving genuine higher mash efficiency figures based on the same methods.
This will mean that all my figures may change and I will start from scratch again. This may also mean that the efficiency with the extended mash out may not be affected as much with the smaller mill setting.
In the end it doesn't really matter what you do, within reason, we all still make beer, it is just that I am a fanatic for figures..

Cheers

 

[DeGarre]

I've noticed that the quicker the wort gets clear during the mash the better the efficiency I get (lately around 88%). The wort for me gets clear quickest when my mash schedule is mash in at 45, then 70 minutes at 66, then 15 minutes at 77 or along those lines, as opposed to a convoluted 5-step schedule with small temp increments.

 

[crhall41]

Hi, am new to this forum as I just purchased my 50L BM a couple months ago. I have found some good BM brewing tips in the AHB posts and am excited to try them out as a newbie BM brewer.

FYI I found that Speidel (or a rep) started a Facebook page for the BM sometime in June of this year. Not much on the page right now but there are a few tips on increasing efficiency - one being pausing the mash cycle 3-4 times to stir your grain bill.

One question I still have about the BM is the notch markings which seem to be slightly off (I poured in 30 liters of water and it came up to just below the 30 liter notch, right around 28.5-29 liters). My best guess on this is that Speidel sets these volume notches greater that actual volume assuming the difference is trub & mash tun loss and that you will not be pulling this out into your fermenter.

My last brew (2nd time on the BM) came in at an unimpressive 65% mash efficiency. To up this efficiency I am going to try the following on my next brew:

- condition my grain bill with 2-3% water the night before.
- mill my grain with my newly purchased Monster 2 roller maltmill (thinking 1-1.2 mm)
- use BrewTarget to determine my mash tun and sparge water volumes.
- stir my mash 3-4 times during the mash cycle.

As mentioned before I have found some very helpful tips/tricks in this and other forums. I hope to be able to add some myself in the future...

cheers!

 

[wide eyed and legless]

Could it be the displacement of the tube etc that you didn't take into account, check your mash schedule in accordance to what you were brewing as for stirring the mash 3 or 4 times I think once is all you need to do in the middle of the mash cycle, I push a piece of pvc tube into the grain bed and give it a jiggle going over the whole grain bed while singing "Bend down turn around pick a bail of cotton".
Another question did you sparge after lifting your mash from the wort ?

 

[syl]

Hi, am new to this forum as I just purchased my 50L BM a couple months ago. I have found some good BM brewing tips in the AHB posts and am excited to try them out as a newbie BM brewer.

FYI I found that Speidel (or a rep) started a Facebook page for the BM sometime in June of this year. Not much on the page right now but there are a few tips on increasing efficiency - one being pausing the mash cycle 3-4 times to stir your grain bill.

One question I still have about the BM is the notch markings which seem to be slightly off (I poured in 30 liters of water and it came up to just below the 30 liter notch, right around 28.5-29 liters). My best guess on this is that Speidel sets these volume notches greater that actual volume assuming the difference is trub & mash tun loss and that you will not be pulling this out into your fermenter.

My last brew (2nd time on the BM) came in at an unimpressive 65% mash efficiency. To up this efficiency I am going to try the following on my next brew:

- condition my grain bill with 2-3% water the night before.
- mill my grain with my newly purchased Monster 2 roller maltmill (thinking 1-1.2 mm)
- use BrewTarget to determine my mash tun and sparge water volumes.
- stir my mash 3-4 times during the mash cycle.

As mentioned before I have found some very helpful tips/tricks in this and other forums. I hope to be able to add some myself in the future...

cheers!

Mill at 1mm - that's fine on a BM.
Do you do any water adjustments? You really should.
What is the mash routine you use?

 

[Rurik]

My last brew (2nd time on the BM) came in at an unimpressive 65% mash efficiency. To up this efficiency I am going to try the following on my next brew:

- condition my grain bill with 2-3% water the night before.
- mill my grain with my newly purchased Monster 2 roller maltmill (thinking 1-1.2 mm)
- use BrewTarget to determine my mash tun and sparge water volumes.
- stir my mash 3-4 times during the mash cycle.

I think people can get to caught up in efficiency and chasing it. I would not bother with things like grain conditioning and water adjustments just yet. Have a look at your crack, the problem with grain crack is that every brewer has a different opinion and most of them are probably right (for their setup).

For me I could not tell you what my mill is set at, as what is important is how the grain is after you crush at. I try to achieve a kibble type of consistency with my grain with the bits about 1.5mm across but I have never measured it or anything. To achieve this start by running the grain through your mill with the rollers set a little smaller then the size of the grain. This will bust the kernel open and give you a consistent particle size to deal with. Now I know I said I could not tell you what my mill gap is but I would guess it would be around 2mm to achieve this but it changes from grain to grain. Start by cracking a small amount and adjust it down until you are just cracking it. Then run the rest of the grain through also I will run mine through twice at the same setting just to be sure it is all the same. My next step is to make my rollers closer together say about 1.6-1.7 (the gap is not important and again will change depending on the grain that I am milling) and run it through. If I am happy with the results I will run it through again to be sure, if I feel the kibble is a tad large I will close the gap by about .1 of a mm. This usually gives me a cracked grain bill that I am happy to brew with.

The other thing I do to improve my efficiency is to rinse the grain in my tube. To do this I put the lid of the BM on a bucket and then the malt tube on top then poor 5l (please note I have a 20l unit so double it for the 50) of water at 79 deg C over it and let it drain. I then add this back into the kettle with about 30min to go in the boil.

Doing these two things has got my brewhouse efficiency to 82.5% concistently. Now I do modify the water but that is only to improve my beer and I have not noted an increase in efficiency for doing so. I don't stop and stir at any point, the machine does it by pumping the water through the malt just make sure you do not have any dough balls at the start. I spent some time with my unit calibrating it so I knew what was what and how much to use a 5l measuring jug was the best thing I had for this.

I would stay with doing a simple grain bill again and again until you know the system (. Say 9.5kg of base malt, .5kg of Crystal or wheat malt bittered to 25 IBU's and your fav finishing hop and US05.

 

[crhall41]

Partial Man - I did sparge with about 5L at 78C though I think more would have been better. I did not do a hydrometer reading at this point which I need to add to my routine in the future.

Beer God - I did not nor do I think I need to do any water adjustments. Our water is very pristine, similar to Pilsen. My mash schedule was 70C for 10 min and 74C for 50 min. I am thinking of the following schedule for my next brew: 40C 52C 63C 70C with mash out/sparge at 78C.

Mini Mash - thx for the tip on milling. I did not think about washing the grains prior to mashing - Is this something everyone does?

 

[crhall41]

sorry my prior replies should have been to 'wide eyed and legless', 'syl', and 'Rurik' respectively...

 

[DeGarre]

The answer to 88-90% mash efficiency is the rinsing/sparging, no breaks or stirring is necessary or any other hocus pocus. With my 20L is mash with 26L and rinse very slowly with 6-7 litres, When the mashing is done I lift the malt pipe onto buckets and the lid and start heating up meanwhile rinsing 1/2L at the time. I've finished rinsing just before 100 degC is reached ie from 77 to 100 is 23 degrees and 65 seconds per 1 degree so what, almost 1/2 hour rinsing and even longer because I keep adding the wort into the kettle which slows down temp rise.

 

[Thefatdoghead]

I changed my crush to 1.9mm and ran a malt bill of 12.6kg pearl pale malt and 1kg of caraaroma, so 13.6kg in the 50l brau. The flow through the malt pipe was good.
Ended up with 67% efficiency and 1.060 at end of boil. I added adjunct to get to 1.070.
Going to try a run on 1.7 because I did notice there were some grains that were cracked but there was still endo sperm inside them. Ill go for 14kg and see if I can get a higher OG. I'm happy with 67% but I just want the higher gravity for IPA and IIPA.

 

[Dan Pratt]

For some input to the discussion, my LHBS in newcastle sets the Mill to 1.4mm when cracking grain for Braumeister users. He then runs it through twice.

I average 80% mash efficiency.

 

[Rurik]

Who do you think taught me how to crack my grain. WIth the six inch rollers that are on his mill I used to use a 1.4mm gap I also did not bother with the first pass as the mill has the balls to go straight to the 1.4. This is an example of there is not a single answer but rather a method to work out what works for your system.

For some input to the discussion, my LHBS in newcastle sets the Mill to 1.4mm when cracking grain for Braumeister users. He then runs it through twice.

I average 80% mash efficiency.

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

Beer God - I did not nor do I think I need to do any water adjustments. Our water is very pristine, similar to Pilsen. My mash schedule was 70C for 10 min and 74C for 50 min. I am thinking of the following schedule for my next brew: 40C 52C 63C 70C with mash out/sparge at 78C.

Soft water is not necessarily ideal brewing water, you're just lucky that its easier to add than take away.

Without derailing this thread with water chemistry, of which I only have a minimal understanding anyway....water treatment can get your pH to the right level and help your efficiency significantly. I live in Canberra with very soft water and have noticed improvements to my efficiency and the taste of my beers with the right salt selection (calcium sulfate for hoppy beers for instance can really make the hops sing).

Check out this water calculator: http://www.brewersfriend.com/mash-chemistry-and-brewing-water-calculator/ Put in your water supply info and compare it to the style of beer you're making - I suspect you'll find a good reason to treat.

 

[crhall41]

Check out this water calculator: http://www.brewersfriend.com/mash-chemistry-and-brewing-water-calculator/ Put in your water supply info and compare it to the style of beer you're making - I suspect you'll find a good reason to treat.

Thanks, ran the report and it recommended adding 0.3 gm of slaked lime to boil and 0.2 ml of lactic acid to my sparge water (assuming I want to reduce the pH to my boil pH of 5.4).

Q? - do you add DME to the grist list for this report?

Q? for everyone - given that the short malt pipe only holds 5.5 kg do most of you add DME or LME for high gravity beers?

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

Thanks, ran the report and it recommended adding 0.3 gm of slaked lime to boil and 0.2 ml of lactic acid to my sparge water (assuming I want to reduce the pH to my boil pH of 5.4).

Q? - do you add DME to the grist list for this report?

Q? for everyone - given that the short malt pipe only holds 5.5 kg do most of you add DME or LME for high gravity beers?


Mash pH is where the magic happens for efficiency. The water book recently published can take you to the Nth degree, but some threads on here can also give you the basics. As DME isn't in the mash it's not relevant for those calculations.

High gravity beers. I've used DME and a "double mash" method - only did that once and probably wouldn't again. There's a "big beers for Braumeister" thread somewhere on these forums (I'm on tapatalk right now so can't link)

 

[Edak]

Which would you not do again? DME or double mash?

 

[Thefatdoghead]

Which would you not do again? DME or double mash?

DME costs more money. Double mash costs more time. Didn't notice any difference in flavour with the DME beer because it had a kilo of hops in it and I used premium pilsen malt extract from briess.
I reckon if i can get to 1.068 without any adjunct im good for most beers I want to brew. 1.070 is a good goal to work towards with a single mash.