Barleywine Recipe Ideas

[Toby5]

Hi guys, I want to do a barleywine at about 8 or 9% alcohol as my next challenge in homebrewing. My mash tun can't hold enough grain to do it ag, so am planning part grain / part extract.

My proposed grainbill works something like this:

4kg base malt (preferably pilsener cos it's lying around, but will switch to ale malt if recommended, mash tun could handle up to 2kg more base malt)
1kg Munich malt or similar (eg victory or biscuit)
200g Crystal malt
200g of Special B Crystal (is this too much crystal? I use a copper manifold slotted at the bottom and have never had a stuck mash/sparge)

In my setup I'm guessing the grainbill would give me OG of 50 for 22 litres. It's not very efficient. (~65%)

Mash - protein rest at 50 degrees for 20min, then bring up to 72 degrees for 90 minutes, batch sparge. Aiming for sweet unfermentable sugars. What colour would this come out do you think? Hoping for a kilkenny type colour, but may be way way off on that. In fact, I've only ever got the colour right once...

Malt

4 kgs malt extract in boil (Should I use light or dark powdered malt? or should I just use one or two tins eg coopers ale? Is the proposed quantity even close to what I might need?)

Hops
I love them all but don't like it too bitter. Open to suggestions on hops. But in the end I'm not fussy and just as happy to close my eyes and throw whatever in. So long as I use some hop plugs in each brew I'm happy.

Yeast
Probably an instant yeast, couple of packs of safale to build up a big starter over 2 or 3 weeks, or better yet do a pale ale first, rack after 5 days and then drop the barleywine onto the yeast cake and use a blow of tube. Cos my regular airlock simply won't be up to the task...

Any suggestions or completely alternate recipes appreciated. Does my proposal even count as a barleywine, or is it just a very strong ale?

 

[Tseay]

Made the following sometime ago, may provide a base for experimetation. needs a long time to develop and mature.

Beer: Barley Wine
Type: Partial mash Size: 15 liters
Color: 20 HCU (~12 SRM)
Bitterness: 50 IBU
OG: 1.099 FG: 1.020
Alcohol: 10.2% v/v (8.0% w/w)
Grain: 3kg 500g British pale
250g British crystal 50-60L
Mash: 65% efficiency
Boil: 75 minutes SG 1.099 15 liters
1kg 700g Light malt extract
500g Light dry malt extract
Hops: 45g Northern Brewer (8.5% AA, 60 min.)
20g Kent Goldings (5% AA, 30 min.)
25g Kent Goldings (aroma)

 

[Guest Lurker]

That malt bill sounds like a barleywine to drink early, with a lot of crystal to cover the hot alcohol, which will also make it sticky and fruity. But in my opinion the best barley wines are not sticky, are drunk aged for 1 to 2 years when the alcohol has smoothed out, and the complex flavours come from maillard reactions in a long boil and some oxidation. Based on advice from people here I brewed one with 100% pale malt that placed well in a couple of comps. It finished up pretty dark, getting on for Kilkenny.

So if you are planning to keep it, I would reverse a lot of those ideas ie
no crystal
no special b
maybe keep the munich
mash at 66, maybe lower given the potential unfermentables in the extract
use the lightest extract you can
dont bother with any late hops
boil long
the yeast cake is a good idea

 

[crozdog]

Toby,

A couple of ideas:
1. you can increase your gravity by dropping the volume (Tseay's recipe is for 15L)
2. use straight malt. kits are already hopped
3. instead of guessing what the gravity impact / colour etc will be, download brewsta/beersmith/promash or beertools to help with your formulation.
4. Big beers like these can hide a lot of hops - don't be scarred of em they add character B)
5. Wht step mash? just do a simgle infusion @ about 68 for an hour. Lots of evidence now that conversion completes after 20 minutes
6. be prepared to leave it for an extended period to allow the flavours to develop. I was recently part of a vertical tasting of Coopers vintage ales & the best ones were over 5 years old. The "young uns" were totally different.
7. Head over to www.bjcp.org & download the style guidelines & flashcards. These will help you heaps. For example the following will give you pointers on what to aim for:


19B. English Barleywine
Category: 19. STRONG ALE
OG: 1.080 1.120+ FG: 1.018 1.030+ ABV: 8-12+%
IBU: 35 70 SRM: 8 22
Aroma: Very rich and strongly malty, often with a caramel-like aroma. May have moderate to strong fruitiness, often with a dried-fruit character. English hop aroma may range from mild to assertive. Alcohol aromatics may be low to moderate. The intensity of these aromatics often subsides with age. The aroma may have a rich character including bready, toasty, toffee, molasses, and/or treacle notes. Aged versions may have a sherry-like quality, possibly vinous or port-like aromatics, and generally more muted malt aromas. Low to no diacetyl.

Appearance: Color ranges from rich gold to very dark amber or even dark brown. Often has ruby highlights, but not opaque. Low to moderate off-white head; may have low head retention. May be cloudy with chill haze at cooler temperatures, but generally clears to good to brilliant clarity as it warms. The color may appear to have great depth, as if viewed through a thick glass lens. High alcohol and viscosity may be visible in legs when beer is swirled in a glass.

Flavor: Strong, intense, complex, multi-layered malt flavors ranging from bready and biscuity through nutty, deep toast, dark caramel, toffee, and/or molasses. Moderate to high malty sweetness on the palate, although the finish may be moderately sweet to moderately dry (depending on aging). Some oxidative or vinous flavors may be present, and often complex alcohol flavors should be evident. Moderate to fairly high fruitiness, often with a dried-fruit character. Hop bitterness may range from just enough for balance to a firm presence; balance therefore ranges from malty to somewhat bitter. Low to moderately high hop flavor (usually UK varieties). Low to no diacetyl.

Mouthfeel: Full-bodied and chewy, with a velvety, luscious texture (although the body may decline with long
conditioning). A smooth warmth from aged alcohol should be present. Carbonation may be low to moderate, depending on age and conditioning.

Overall Impression: The richest and strongest of the English Ales. A showcase of malty richness and complex, intense flavors. The character of these ales can change significantly over time; both young and old versions should be appreciated for what they are. The malt profile can vary widely; not all examples will have all possible flavors or aromas.

 

[pint of lager]

Rather than trying to brew a full 23 litres, why not just scale back a bit on the volume, and brew all grain, rather than trying to up the og with extract.

Your idea of using some yeast cake is a great idea for these big beers.

 

[mikem108]

You're going to need to keep that beer for a while and as time passes it will become more malty so don't be afraid to lay the hops in. Add a small ammount (450gms/23l or so) of dextrose or cane sugar to increase drinkability. I can vouch for Croz's assertion that conversion is complete in about 20 mins as have been doing experiments in this department lately to cut down the brew day.
After 10 mins, stir mash, After 20 mins do about 6-7 litres of recirculation over a 10-15 minute period, do an iodine test, if all is OK begin the sparge. So far iodine test has given the all clear at the 20 minute mark.

 

[GMK]

I made up a 28 ltr batch of this 18 months ago.

Only have 5 left.
Aging really well.

Here is the recipe scaled down to handle 6kg Mash tun.

Hope it helps.

J.W.Lees Harvest Ale

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 13.00 Wort Size (L): 13.00
Total Grain (kg): 5.99
Anticipated OG: 1.116 Plato: 27.18
Anticipated SRM: 11.6
Anticipated IBU: 69.6
Brewhouse Efficiency: 81 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate: 20.00 Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size: 18.57 L
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.081 SG 19.58 Plato


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
2.4 0.14 kg. Lyles Golden Syrup UK 1.040 3
94.9 5.68 kg. TF Maris Otter Pale Ale Malt UK 1.037 3
2.7 0.16 kg. TF Crystal UK 1.034 74

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
40.30 g. Wye Target Pellet 11.00 65.1 90 min.
11.38 g. Goldings - E.K. Pellet 4.75 3.7 15 min.
9.75 g. Goldings - E.K. Pellet 4.75 0.8 3 min.
9.10 g. Goldings - E.K. Plug 4.75 0.0 Dry Hop


Yeast
-----




Mash Schedule
-------------

Mash Type: Single Step

Grain kg: 5.85
Water Qts: 12.53 - Before Additional Infusions
Water L: 11.86 - Before Additional Infusions

L Water Per kg Grain: 2.03 - Before Additional Infusions

Saccharification Rest Temp : 66 Time: 90
Mash-out Rest Temp : 0 Time: 0
Sparge Temp : 78 Time: 20


Total Mash Volume L: 15.76 - Dough-In Infusion Only

All temperature measurements are degrees Celsius.

View attachment J.W.Lees_Harvest_Ale.txt

 

[Toby5]

Thanks everyone, all that info has given me heaps to think about (and then act on). I'll let you know my final recipe and how it turns out (which won't be for a year cos of conditioning time... heh heh who am I kidding, I always crack one early)

Cheers :beer:

 

[Thirsty Boy]

I'll add a vote for not being scared of the hops...

Hop bitterness drops off pretty drastically over a period of 6-12 months (even sooner) and by the time your barley wine has aged, the bitterness will come back into balance.

I made a 9.8% version with the malt bill 100% Pale malt and 10% of the fermentables coming from palm sugar. Bittered it to about 65-70IBU.

Bitter as buggery out of the ketttle, same out of fermentor and I thought I'd stuffed it up... but six months later and the bitterness is now just a little more than balancing the sweetness, in another 6 months it will be just right.

Have fun