Assistant Ale

[Wardhog]

I need a brew assistant. Number one candidate is my father, a VB and Melbourne Bitter drinker from years back. However, he dismisses AG as 'way too much bloody hard work'. I need to show him the light.
I'm looking to make a beer that's
-pale
-PORed
-inoffensive
Basically, a beer that is how VB would be if it was made according to the Reinheitsgebot, in order to show him that all that hard work IS worthwhile.


I'm thinking
2.5kg pale ale malt
2.5kg pilsener malt
200g Carapils
All mashed at 64C.
15g POR at 60minutes
5g POR at 30 minutes

US-56 at 18C.

Comments?

 

[Barry]

Good Day

A very good Aussie BBQ Blond IMHO.

 

[Fents]

Wardhog...

Dave @ GBHS makes nearly the exact same recipe but he use's Caramalt insteap of carapils...
oh and i realised he dosnt really use POR.

I made somthing similar not to long agao and it cam,e out beautifully. I wouldnt say it came out like a VB type tho.

 

[DJR]

Might be too much carapils if you're not adding sugar to dumb the body down. POR is probably OK to bitter but do you have anything else to bitter or for flavour - hallertau? Something noble? Magnum? A moderate whack (maybe 15g) of Hallertau or something noble with make it more like an Aussie Premium. Wheat doesn't go astray in that sort of recipe either.

US56 will be fine, will turn out quite lager like, some CCing will help with that too. The 64C mash temp will help with the dryness, but i'd say drop the Reinheitsegbot requirement and add in 10 to 15% sugar (and drop the grainbill accordingly) to help it finish with a low SG like most aussie lagers do (shoot me down and call me a non-purist).

Does he like Coopers Pale Ale or can't he stand it?

 

[AUHEAMIC]

Hi Wardhog

I made a beer for SWMBO recently I think may be what youre looking for. Very pale, low hoped 20IBU. One of my brew buddys tasted it on the weekend and said Tastes like commercial stuff.

I dont have the recipe at work but it went something like,
90% Pils
5% Light crystal
5% Wheat

EK goldings

One fermenter with S04 and the other with US56.

Anyway I live in Diamond Creek and Im happy to give you a sample. PM me if you want.

 

[Thirsty Boy]

I like the sound of your recipe and might just brew it myself, but maybe, just maybe...

If your father is a VB/MB drinker, you could lighten the body a little bit with some adjunct . Cane sugar if you are looking at authenticity or corn or rice. Not in the sort of amounts where it would impact flavour too much, but 5-10% just so its not too malty for him

I know that takes away from the Reinheitsgebot thing though. You could start him off with adjunct, and wean him off it like a junkie on Methadone

 

[Wardhog]

Might be too much carapils if you're not adding sugar to dumb the body down. POR is probably OK to bitter but do you have anything else to bitter or for flavour - hallertau? Something noble? Magnum? A moderate whack (maybe 15g) of Hallertau or something noble with make it more like an Aussie Premium. Wheat doesn't go astray in that sort of recipe either.

I'm out to use the same hops and schedule, this is more an experimental brew for me. As I understand it, the CUB megaswill in question is only POR, so that's what I'll use.

US56 will be fine, will turn out quite lager like, some CCing will help with that too. The 64C mash temp will help with the dryness, but i'd say drop the Reinheitsegbot requirement and add in 10 to 15% sugar (and drop the grainbill accordingly) to help it finish with a low SG like most aussie lagers do (shoot me down and call me a non-purist).

Does he like Coopers Pale Ale or can't he stand it?

Would dextrose to 10% be reasonable? Or are you talking table sugar?

CPA would come under the heading of 'fancy schmancy beer'.

 

[sluggerdog]

Recipe looks good however I would be adding around 500 - 1000 grams of flaked rice and lowering the pilsner/pale malt as others have suggested.

Also 15 grams of saaz at 15 mins would go down a treat but not 100% necessary.

Maybe something like:

40% pale ale malt
45% pilsener malt
10% Flaked Rice
5% Carapils

15g POR at 60minutes
15g Saaz at 15 minutes

IBU a total of 25 ish. If with the saaz your over, lower the POR

 

[DJR]

CUB only use hop extract, isohop or tetra-isohop nowadays i thought. Look at the side of a bottle of VB original ale - they say "kettle hopped" :lol: POR will do fine, but leave the 30m addition out, you'll get enough POR character using it for bittering only.

White/castor/table sugar or dextrose is fine, not much difference in taste with less than 25% of the grainbill.

Carapils will add too much body, having 90% grain in the batch will give adequate results. Replace the carapils with wheat if you want the meringue like CUB foam (comes from PGA but wheat malt will do the same sort of thing), or just drop it to 100g if you can't leave it out.

 

[warrenlw63]

Oddly enough a beer that tastes like such filth as VB is probably harder to make than you think. Sounds almost self-contradictory huh? :blink:

Bear in mind Wardhog that with the ingredients and sugar addition you're essentially making a beer that has no spots to hide flaws. If you ferment with US56 I'd keep the pitch and ferment temps on the low side (around 15).

If it was me (was in a similar situation) I'd be making a basic non-offensive Pale Ale and giving him a go at that. Sometimes these brand-loyalists can really surprise you. My old man was a Hahn Lite devotee. He now drinks anything I throw at him homebrew wise and particularly loves a Porter when I make it.

Edit: If you want to skip the sugar addition Sub half your grainbill for Galaxy Malt. It finishes as dry as a beer augmented with sugar.

Warren -

 

[Screwtop]

Wardhog, I'd look seriously at AndrewQld's Australian Ale recipe.

 

[goatherder]

Wardhog, I've made a very similar beer to yours, although I used wheat instead of carapils. I was looking for a beer to please some megaswillers and it certainly did that. They loved it. I used some cluster instead of your PoR flavour addition, just to give it that XXXX twist. Your recipe is spot on for your intention but fortunately, it won't be anything like VB

 

[Wardhog]

Thanks for all the replies and helpful suggestions, I think I've narrowed it down to this:

42% ale malt
42% pilsener malt
10% dextrose
6% wheat malt

20g POR @ 60 minutes

US-56

I'll aim for 1.045-1.048 OG, around 20 IBU, and as clean and lager-like a ferment I can manage. I'll try to swing a 1 week CC too.
Wish me luck, 30+ litres of really hot wort is getting too much for me to lift alone.

 

[oldbugman]

Looks like that would come out quite light, I would put a touch of crystal in there aswell.

 

[Wardhog]

If your father is a VB/MB drinker, you could lighten the body a little bit with some adjunct . Cane sugar if you are looking at authenticity or corn or rice. Not in the sort of amounts where it would impact flavour too much, but 5-10% just so its not too malty for him

When does the cane sugar go into the wort? Start of boil, near the end of the boil, after the boil, at yeast pitching time?

 

[DJR]

Add the sugar whenever, personally i add it to the kettle just before it boils, but if you are no-chilling you can add it when you dump into the fermenter, which also gives you a chance to adjust your OG.

 

[goatherder]

It doesn't really matter when the sugar goes in, but it's useful to put it in before the end of the boil so it gets sterilised with the rest of the wort. I put mine in with 10 mins to go.

 

[Wardhog]

Oh poop.

I just racked the ale into secondary for lagering, and there was a VERY slimy looking head on it, and a faint whiff of bananas. I think it's infected, can anyone tell me different? I've never seen US56 throw a head like that before, and not at the end of primary fermentation.

The dozen or so k&k, extract, partials I did, not one infection. Third frigging AG, I get an infection. :angry:

 

[Wardhog]

Time to get back on the horse. Will be doing this again tonight, BIAB style.

2.2kg pale ale malt
2.2kg pilsner malt
200g Carapils
500g table sugar

15g POR at 60 min.

US-56 at 16C

Can one of the BIAB proponents cast an eye over the method, and tell me if I'm on the money or not?

Fill keggle with 38 litres of 69C water, looking for strike temp of 64C
Stir vigorously every 5 minutes for first half hour, then every 10 minutes for another 30 minutes

Will I have to MacGuyver some temporary insulation for the keggle, or will the thermal mass look after itself for the first 30 minutes?

Boil 60 minutes, POR addition at start, sugar in 10 min from end.

Hopefully I'll have enough left over for some sort of starter. Don't have ProMash handy, and can't remember what the target OG was last time