Poors Foam

[davea]

Guys,

Having a bit a problem with my first beer exercise.

Ive just got around to setting everything up, however when I open the tap to poor a beer it just comes out all froth. It has some look of beer to it but its not clear as it comes out. The froth settles down fairly quickly but its still fairly un drinkable. If you drink it I tastes really watery (like a mix of half beer half water). It beer itself appears to have no bubbles in the glass. (its a single tap, single regulator setup)

With the reg its attached to a fire extinguisher, and every time I close press the handle it sets off the relief value and makes the weird noise. I have only been able to get the reading down to 1.5bar where I know people have told me it has to be at 1. Ive screwed the micromatic part as far in (towards the gauges) as possible (its now sitting flush against the whole regulator) but I cant get it down to 1 bar. Could this be the problem? Am I doing the correct thing screwing the micromatic part all the way in? The other gauge on the reg doesnt move at all and is sitting on the red part at 0.

There is about 2 metre of gas pipe. About 3 metre of beer line. (1 metre of 4mm pipe connected inside the font) and 2 metre of 6mm pipe jointed by a 4-6mm connecter. In the beer line the beer is all clear and when the tap is open the beer stays clear until the joiner (where I can no longer see it as its a thicker unclear tube)

It would be fantastic if someone could give me some points to try. Its killing me having the beer but not being able to drink it.

Cheers
Dave

 

[dr K]

Quick answers:
Why are you using a Fire Extinguisher Botle?..Yes we know why.
If you are going to keg your beers then you have to realise just how important CO2 is and what a danger O2 is.
Now I know this is not going to solve your immediate problem and nor will it expalin the watered down taste that you get.
If you wander into your local (insert gas company name) outlet they will hire you a cylinder for CO2 at $10-$15 per month, you then pay for a fill (price varies on size) but the fill you get is CO2...nothing else (and do not give a crack about about food grade..so what food uses CO2..woops beer..but you get the idea , CO2 is CO2).
Decants, transfers, whatever have a very high chance of being adulterated by air, now some people say not to worry about the air but that air is some 20% Oxygen and it is going to screw your beer right royally.

K

 

[tangent]

poor beer, or pour beer? vastly different.

 

[browndog]

Hi Dave, I am struggling a bit to follow you, however, if you are winding the knob on the regulator in (clockwise) then you are increasing the pressure to the keg. The guage should be sitting on 75 to 100KPA to get a good pour. Release the pressure on the keg with the bleed valve on the keg, then with the knob on the guage wound right out, pull the trigger on the fire extinguisher and while holding the trigger in, turn the knob on the regulator till you get about 75kpa showing. This should give you the correct pressure in the keg and a good pour. You will have to give the fire extinguisher a squirt every now and then to keep the pressure up.

cheers

Browndog

 

[winkle]

Hi Dave, I am struggling a bit to follow you, however, if you are winding the knob on the regulator in (clockwise) then you are increasing the pressure to the keg. The guage should be sitting on 75 to 100KPA to get a good pour. Release the pressure on the keg with the bleed valve on the keg, then with the knob on the guage wound right out, pull the trigger on the fire extinguisher and while holding the trigger in, turn the knob on the regulator till you get about 75kpa showing. This should give you the correct pressure in the keg and a good pour. You will have to give the fire extinguisher a squirt every now and then to keep the pressure up.

cheers

Browndog

BD maybe the problem is that the beer isn't properly carbonated first??
Pushing uncarbonated beer out a tap would be bloody disappointing (and perhaps initally frothy).

davea, try searching "carbonating kegs" there are a few threads that will probably answer most questions (or the "Ross Method").
A photo of your set-up might help, 3 meters of line might be excessive.

 

[als_world]

Hi Dave,

Something's not right there. If it's the hig pressure guage that sitting in the red at zero you won't be getting any CO2 pressure at all, so the 1.5 bar must be coming from back pressure, which might explain why you can't get it any lower. As Browndog said, purge the pressure on the keg relief valve and see what happens. The regulator relief valve opening/weird noise doesn't sound good either. Does your fire ex have a pin to lock the handle in the "open" position, or do you have to hold it down to get CO2 pressure?

Are you able to post a pic of the fire ex and reg showing attachment, and also the guages on the reg when the fire ex handle is open, that would help to pinpont the problem.

Cheers,

Alan.

 

[Gulf Brewery]

davea

If you have got the beer over carbonated and it pours froth, then the Co2 will be driven out of the beer very quickly and it will appear flat.

Are you opening the beer tap full when you pour the beer?

Cheers
Pedro

 

[Screwtop]

Dave, high pressure is used to force carbonate the beer, once youve got the bubbles in they will pretty much stay there in cold beer under a little pressure. You then need to determine what serving pressure is required for your system. Wind back the reg until there is very low or no pressure registering in the delivery guage, vent off the keg and open the tap with a glass underneath, then wind in the reg slowly until the pressure just starts to rise the beer moves. You will soon find the pressure where your beer pours nicely. After serving a session I give the kegs a squirt and bring them up to 100Kpa and leave them at that. Before serving I drop the pressure to serving pressure by venting the keg and watching the guage.

Screwy,

Declaration: Multiple Fire Extinguisher User

 

[paul]

Sounds like you need to balance your system to me screwtop. If you increase the length of your beer line you wont have to drop the pressure out to pour a beer or put more gas in once youve finished your session.

 

[Haydo]

Not possible that your kegs are freezing up? The half beer half water taste sounds a bit strange to me, so might pay to check this.

 

[winkle]

Not possible that your kegs are freezing up? The half beer half water taste sounds a bit strange to me, so might pay to check this.

How come I didn't think of that, probably the cause since its happened to me before
Pull them out of the fridge for a while and check the fridge settings.

 

[Screwtop]

Sounds like you need to balance your system to me screwtop. If you increase the length of your beer line you wont have to drop the pressure out to pour a beer or put more gas in once youve finished your session.

You ain't seen my system Paul - Very Elaborate :lol:

 

[davea]

Sorry guys, back from holidays now so i can really get into finishing the system off...

i found i was winding the reg the wrong way... ive now wound it completly out and when i squeeze it comes up to about 70 kpa (and nothing on the other one, bar side)... when i wind the knob in and give it another sqirt i get it about 1/3 in where it sits at the 1 bar level (which ive been told), however the other guage drops down to between 65-68 kpa.. after playing with it i cant get it anywhere near the 75-100kpa...

im not sure if the keg has been carbinated but above people say it could be over carbination, or not being carbinated at all... is there a way to determine if its been carbinated for yet?

no issue with the weird noise now which is great, and i do have a pin but should it really been locked down in the on position all the time, i thought the best way was to just keep giving it a squirt every once in a while...

so its still pouring foam, not as heavy as it was before but its still not drinkable...

thanks for your help guys

 

[pint of lager]

If it is pouring at a slowish speed from the tap to the glass, but is too foamy, then your beer is overcarbonated. Are you opening the tap up fully like Gulf asked? Do you have the beer line hooked up to the correct post?

Keep releasing the head pressure in the keg by releasing the pressure relief valve. Do this once an hour for 4 hours, then, add some pouring gas pressure back into the keg, see if you can pour a non foamy beer. If it is still too foamy, then release the pressure again over 4 hours.

Cannot help you with the fire extinguisher. But by opening and shutting the tap on the co2 quickly, you should be able to control your gas.

 

[skb]

I have been doing a bit of a fridge clean very hot here in Sydney today and I went out of a while with the power off and the kegs out of the fridge. I got back put it all back together and now I am getting foam only pour does anybody know if this is a side effect of letting the kegs heat up a bit ??

 

[pint of lager]

About 3 metre of beer line. (1 metre of 4mm pipe connected inside the font) and 2 metre of 6mm pipe jointed by a 4-6mm connecter. In the beer line the beer is all clear and when the tap is open the beer stays clear until the joiner (where I can no longer see it as its a thicker unclear tube)

I have just seen another huge problem with your setup.

Your beerline must stay the same diameter the whole way along.

When the carbonated beer moves from a small diameter pipe, to a larger diameter pipe, it decreases the pressure and the dissolved carbon dioxide comes out of solution which shows as foam.

Go buy some more beerline (3m) of the correct diameter and replace the whole length. Do some reading up on balanced systems and balance the system up.

It is impossible at this stage to say whether your beer is correctly carbonated or not. The usual problem with first time keggers, especially if they force carbonate with shaking, is to overcarbonate the keg.

 

[Jazzafish]

I have been doing a bit of a fridge clean very hot here in Sydney today and I went out of a while with the power off and the kegs out of the fridge. I got back put it all back together and now I am getting foam only pour does anybody know if this is a side effect of letting the kegs heat up a bit ??

As the beer heats up the CO2 will escape the beer... so I say yeah.

 

[davea]

I cant run a single line as the font has its own 4mm line which is connected at the top the font and comes about 60cm out of the bottom, so on advise of people ive got 2 metres more of 6mm line and connected it by a steal connector... i had a look up the top of the font and once i unscrew it i can see how i change the tube over...

beer is going from large pipe to small...

yes taps whole way open

black connector to the out part of the keg going into the font, grey connector has been used from the regulator

im going to try the de gassing it so ill let you know if i have any sucess....

 

[paul]

If its an Andale type of font all you do to change the line is undo the nut and remove the old line. Cut the olive out of the old line and pull the nut off the old line. Get your new line and slide the nut over it then insert the olive into the new line and screw this back into the plastic piece in the font.

 

[davea]

hmmm, so ive been pulling the relief value for a couple of days now and its still releasing a fair amount of gas everytime i do it.. would this be pretty fair to say its over carbed?