Partigyle Imperial Old Ale Recipe Critique Using Wyeast 9097-pc Old Al

[Bizier]

I am entering the Iron Brew comp, but I was late for a few reasons, so I abandoned my grand plan of using the packet of Wyeast Old Ale blend that I purchased. Now I am planning the beer that I will make to use this, and I want it to be a proper good one to stick in the corner for a good while and bring out on special occasions.

I am looking at trying to run off a very high gravity wort (whatever I can get) to make up a standard batch. Fermenting in glass for a while at a lower temp like 18 to keep the hottest part of fermentation restrained and then raise to 20 or so, and eventually move out to a "cool" part of the house, adding a small amount of oak, then kegging and leaving longer, burping every so often.

Here is my recipe for a 22L batch:
10.00 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (Thomas Fawcett) 64.52 %
5.00 kg Pale Malt, Traditional Ale (Joe White) 32.26 %
0.50 kg Caraaroma (Weyermann) 3.23 %

40.00 gm Target 08 [9.40 %] (60 min) Hops 41.3 IBU
40.00 gm Goldings, East Kent 08 [4.80 %] (60 min) Hops 21.1 IBU


I am calling the efficiency 50% - which is roughly 80% (rough estimate of efficiency) x 60% (a figure pulled from internet for partigyle brewing) and I will try to do one runout without mashout, or decoct to mashout (a better idea), then try to get a good batch sparge out of the remainder to pull out what sugars I can, while making preboil volume.

Beersmith tells me an OG of 1.111 and 62.3IBU, but to be honest, I am not super interested in hitting these numbers, just want gravity, and for the bitterness to last a while.

I have never used brett before (sad, I know), nor partigyle brewing, so I am keen on both recipe formulation and ferment advice.

Cheers,
Dan

 

[Bizier]

Hehe, the title comes up as 'Old Al' I assume because I reached the character limit. Old Al' he will be.

 

[brettprevans]

I'm confused. What's ur partigyle recipe? From ur description it just sounds like your combining 1st and 2nd runnings as per normal. A partigyle is taking big gravity 1st runnings to make a beer then sparking and taking the 2nd runnings and making a 2nd seperate beer.

And u should mash out for both. Mash outs are good.

If u miss OG by a fair whack and u want to correct, adding some dry malt
Extract won't be noticed in the final beer as it such a big beer with Brett.

 

[sinkas]

does the old ale blend actaully have any brett in it?

if its the same one they had out a couple of years ago, I found that with a big 1100 plus beer, it was very hard to keep a 25 litre brew cool in a small fridge so proceed with care

 

[Bizier]

CM2 - I was planning on trying to entirely drain the mashtun as a first runnings without adding extra liquid. I would be just running off a reasonably stiff mash, and then doing one rinsing step at mashout temp to follow it up to make volume. I will use whatever is left with some crystal to make as innofensive a brew as I can manage, say 25 IBU of EKG. If it reeks of tannins, then I will have learned something.

Sinkas - Yes it is the vintage release w/brett. I figure it will be OK with a starter. And yes, that is why I want to try to do the bulk of fermenting as low as I can. I know it will be explosive at warm temps. Hell, I just used 1099 on a two different beers and both foamed over at 19-20C. I figure that even if the sacc strain doesn't like it and has a messy ferment in terms of byproducts, it will have a chance when it is warmed up, and whatever byproducts are left will be in contact with brett for months, so I am hoping that they will be cleaned up in time.

 

[barls]

this is what i do for my barley wines,
mash in drain get my volume (top up with second runnings) then boil. while boiling add extra grain then mash in again. once the other boil is complete and out of the pot, i drain the second runnings in to the pot and sparge out.

the old ale blend is one of my favs. works perfectly in a barley wine. just let it sit for a while like 6 months before bottling.

 

[Josh]

Looks fine to me. 1.111 sounds pretty high for an old ale. I reckon it'd be a good one to let sit for a while too. I've used that yeast once before and after a year and a half it had soured a fair bit. Pretty delicious.

 

[Bizier]

Holy Jeebus!

I made a 2L stirplate starter, poured beer off and topped up again with cubed wort, the stuff was rocketing after 2 hours, so I pitched at 15C... And now I have reined it down a degree to 14C because of the rate of growth. This stuff is hectic.

My mash was a total PITA, and it took ages. If I were to do this again, I would definitely be stepping up from very low temps and raise to a protein rest, and then to sacc and MO. I thought I got 1.097 from a refrac reading, but my hydro last night was exactly 1.111 which is very strange. I was a little short on volume, so it is a complete fluke on the part of more than one variable. I am going to top up with an DME/water solution at the OG to ensure I have more beer, even if the bitterness will be out a little.

Thanks for the advice, and especially to Sinkas re temps, this thing is a bomb.

 

[Dazza88]

What's the tasting like for this beast?

 

[super_simian]

I'm confused. What's ur partigyle recipe? From ur description it just sounds like your combining 1st and 2nd runnings as per normal. A partigyle is taking big gravity 1st runnings to make a beer then sparking and taking the 2nd runnings and making a 2nd seperate beer.

No. No it's not.

 

[mje1980]

No. No it's not.

Isn't it? I thought like cm2, a partigyle was making one beer ( higher alc ) from the 1st runnings, then a smaller beer from the 2nd runnings?.

 

[Bizier]

Wow, old thread.

I made the beer in question, and the second runnings went to make a "whatever beer that will be" which I pitched 3711 onto, and it attenuated it into a second full strength beer anyway. That second beer is actually the quickest my partner and I have ever gone through a keg, it was delicious.

The old ended up really complex and liquer like, and more than one person deemed it to be a Belgian dark strong ale of some kind. It had lots of dried fruit flavours. My GF's mother, not a beer drinker, actually may have been turned onto beer by this one, as it was kind of like an old fortified wine or something. From memory I also aged on American oak.

ED: the concentrated-ness of the final beer inhibited the brett flavours somewhat. I am pretty sure that the brett delivered on adding the fruitiness, but it did not seem to hyperattenuate or develop barnyard characteristics at this gravity or using this technique or recipe.

 

[Yob]

No. No it's not.

You may need to eloborate..

HERE and every other source of info Ive looked at says Partigyle is making separate beers.

 

[Dazza88]

thanks bizier. mmmm candan belgian ale yeast o this one? decisions.

 

[mje1980]

No. No it's not.

http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/libr...2.2/mosher.html

http://www.byo.com/component/resource/arti...wing-techniques

http://beersmith.com/blog/2011/10/07/parti...-from-one-mash/

Can you explain your reply?