New Homebrew Endeavour

[unco_tomato]

Hey guys,

While I've been home brewing small batches in a 20L Urn and then just using bottles to store all of my beer after fermenting I am finally ready to take it all up to the next level. I have no budget, but don't recommend a $400 tap just for the hell of it, please only suggest expensive gear if it is significantly superior to a cheaper alternative. I'll be stepping up to 4 Urns, and what I need help with is replacing my bottling with kegging. I've never kegged before, and basically want to be able to store and serve two 19L kegs in my bar fridge. I have a fermenting fridge sorted, and can store 40-60L happily, I just need something more efficient than bottling once the beer is done in the fermenter.

So, can you guys help me? Has anyone here built a "kegerator" before and can provide a list of tools and parts needed? Essentially I want two kegs in the bar fridge with two taps coming out the top of the fridge if possible, though I will go out the door if I have to.

I need the following from what I can tell:

CO2 Gas canister to charge the kegs/lines
Two 19L Kegs
Two Taps
A crap ton of "food safe" tubing
Gas Regulator
Fridge Digital Thermal Controller

I know a need a whole bunch of O rings, washers, seals and other goodies, but I have no idea where to start. I know I am asking a lot here, and for people to basically do a fair chunk of work to help me out, but it is much appreciated.

SO I guess the question is, if you were going to do it, how would you go about it, and what would you buy?

 

[argon]

Have a read of this wiki article first.

Helped me out when i was doing it, as i too had no idea.

From memory it's got parts list and is a pretty good reference.

You can always contact the sponsors. They're always good for helping with a setup.

Some top tips;
- use John Guest push connect fittings, wherever you can... sooo much easier than barbs
- taps are cheaper from the states... good quality stainless is the way to go. Perlick 525ss or the new flow regulator ones are even better.
- always, ALWAYS, use a non return valve to protect your gas regulator
- buy your CO2 bottle as it will end up cheaper in the long run

 

[.DJ.]

How would I go about it? This is what I did..

ring Ross at craftbrewer, explain what set up you need/want and he cant suggest the best set up...

But for taps, I have a flow controlled Celli... no need to worry about length of beer lines that way... :super:

 

[Malted]

Forget three extra urns. Buy a 50L Braumeister. Use the urn you have for sparging the Braumeister. Much easier to brew a double batch in this wonderful '1 vessell' system. Keep using the same bench, no gas needed but you will need a 15amp GPO.

 

[brettprevans]

Have a read of this wiki article first.

listen to argon he's a smart man

ring Ross at craftbrewer,

in writting that wiki I had done exactly that, ie called Ross for assistance. any good keg retailer shoudl eb able to assist you in identifying/customising a system for you.

But for taps, I have a flow controlled Celli... no need to worry about length of beer lines that way... :super:

taps -yup agree with DJ.. really only 2 options. celli or perlicks. they are the best. dependds on what you want out of a tap. if your a lazy kegger then cellis are great as they are flow control. but they are pricey.

the only other thing i would consider getting is a picnic tap (with stretchy beerline) from craftbrewer(ross). they are awsome and great fopr taking kegs to parties etc. and they are cheap

 

[unco_tomato]

First of all thanks for the help guys, much appreciated

I'll go to Craft Brewer and give them a call I guess, thanks for the tip

Forget three extra urns. Buy a 50L Braumeister. Use the urn you have for sparging the Braumeister. Much easier to brew a double batch in this wonderful '1 vessell' system. Keep using the same bench, no gas needed but you will need a 15amp GPO.

I planned on doing extra 20L urns as it would allow me to brew multiple beer types at once, instead of being stuck with 50L of IPA one month, then 50L of Stout the next. Also, I'm still fairly new to brewing, so don't want to make a batch of 50L beer which didn't turn out tasting like I imagined it would.

Thanks for the tips and suggestions guys! Keep 'em coming.

 

[Diesel80]

First of all thanks for the help guys, much appreciated

I'll go to Craft Brewer and give them a call I guess, thanks for the tip



I planned on doing extra 20L urns as it would allow me to brew multiple beer types at once, instead of being stuck with 50L of IPA one month, then 50L of Stout the next. Also, I'm still fairly new to brewing, so don't want to make a batch of 50L beer which didn't turn out tasting like I imagined it would.

Thanks for the tips and suggestions guys! Keep 'em coming.

Just checking, you have sufficient power supply on your circuits to run 3/4 urns right?

Otherwise you may need some pots and gas burners as well!

Cheers,
D80

 

[unco_tomato]

You raise a good point sir.

I know one of my circuits has good power as it was upgraded for my PC (I'm a tech Journo), but the other circuits I'm not too sure about. I'll need to get that tested!

 

[d3vour3r]

check sources such as gumtree, ebay and freecycle for fridges, freezers and the odd peice of keg equipment.

if u buy a corny keg (19L), make sure u replace the seals. sponsors sell the kits cheap. and get sum lube.

a tip tho if buying a fridge/freezer second hand. when contacted seller, tell them to turn the fridge/freezer on to its coldest setting a day before arriving to pick it up. and bring a thermometer with u, just a cheap one of ebay, to check the temp . this way you wont get stooged with a not working or shitfully working fridge, that u'll have to dump yourself.

or if ur budget allows buy a brand new keggerator from sponsors. check kegking as well. they fit 2 sumtimes 3 kegs in them, come with CO2 bottle and fonts etc.

 

[Malted]

Forget three extra urns. Buy a 50L Braumeister. Use the urn you have for sparging the Braumeister. Much easier to brew a double batch in this wonderful '1 vessell' system. Keep using the same bench, no gas needed but you will need a 15amp GPO.

I planned on doing extra 20L urns as it would allow me to brew multiple beer types at once, instead of being stuck with 50L of IPA one month, then 50L of Stout the next. Also, I'm still fairly new to brewing, so don't want to make a batch of 50L beer which didn't turn out tasting like I imagined it would.

Thanks for the tips and suggestions guys! Keep 'em coming.

Yeah I don't like stout either.
Forget three extra urns. Buy a 20L Braumeister. Use the urn you have for sparging the Braumeister. Much easier to brew all sorts of beers in this wonderful '1 vessell' system. Much better than BIAB IMHO. Very easy to do a couple of different batches in one afternoon. Keep using the same bench, you will only need a 10amp GPO for the BM and one for the urn. 20L BM is $1000 cheaper than a 50L version.

 

[stux]

I would recommend a minimum of 3 kegs if you plan to run 2 taps.

2 on tap, and one to fill from the fermenter.

Ideal situation then might be to run another gas line from your kegerator to your ferment fridge to gas up your 3rd keg.

4x 20L urns. I'm sorry, that seems a little bit silly :-\

Is your batch size currently 10L?

If so, then the "next step" up is 20L batches... which are perfect for filling a keg.

Perhaps invest in a single 40L urn? or perhaps 2 more?

40L urn will make it easy to do 20L batches, assuming you're biabing


Alternatively, if you have a 3V system I hear you can pipeline your batches...

 

[brettprevans]

leave the man alone re brew systems. he didnt ask about brew systems, . esp not crappy Braumeisters h34r:

he asked about kegging

You raise a good point sir.

I know one of my circuits has good power as it was upgraded for my PC (I'm a tech Journo), but the other circuits I'm not too sure about. I'll need to get that tested!

its not power supply, its ampage. i cant imagaine you needed a 15amp or 20amp power outlet for your PC. if you run that many urns youll be needing more ampage. i assume you can only run 2 urns from the same power point before it cuts out. if you want to use urns just power them from a differant power outlet and you wont have issues with ampage

 

[unco_tomato]

I would recommend a minimum of 3 kegs if you plan to run 2 taps.

2 on tap, and one to fill from the fermenter.

Ideal situation then might be to run another gas line from your kegerator to your ferment fridge to gas up your 3rd keg.

4x 20L urns. I'm sorry, that seems a little bit silly :-\

Is your batch size currently 10L?

If so, then the "next step" up is 20L batches... which are perfect for filling a keg.

Perhaps invest in a single 40L urn? or perhaps 2 more?

40L urn will make it easy to do 20L batches, assuming you're biabing


Alternatively, if you have a 3V system I hear you can pipeline your batches...

I'm currently doing 20L (~19 in reality) batches, I was planning on doing more batches side by side (of different beers) so I can knock out 60-80L of (different) beer in a single arvo and be done for the month.

leave the man alone re brew systems. he didnt ask about brew systems, . esp not crappy Braumeisters h34r:

he asked about kegging


its not power supply, its ampage. i cant imagaine you needed a 15amp or 20amp power outlet for your PC. if you run that many urns youll be needing more ampage. i assume you can only run 2 urns from the same power point before it cuts out. if you want to use urns just power them from a differant power outlet and you wont have issues with ampage

I have a 15A circuit for my PC. It's not your average PC I usually run LN2 and some other cool bits and pieces. I draw up to 2200W+ from the wall at times and my Power Supply(s) in my PC needs to be able to produce around 90A after conversions, so yer, it's a pretty serious rig. I'm pretty sure the rest of the house is 10A, but I'll get someone in to check.

I'd rather just upgrade the kitchen to 15amp too and be done with it. I'll need to call the land lord again though... bloody pain.

 

[stux]

Well, he specifically asked about 19L kegs and implied that he plans to do 4 x 10L batches.

If you have a 19L keg, then, really, unless you plan to blend everything, you should be doing 19L batches... right?

So a fair point.

Meanwhile, a 20L braumeister is a pretty good way to fill a 19L keg. If you don't get sticker shock.

...

Anyway,

Perlick 525s in stainless steel, try farmhousebrewing in the US. you need to email the guy for a quote. Alternaively, the Perlick flow controllers, but they're chrome plated.

Use John Guest fittings.

Buy your C02 bottle. Probably better to go for a smaller bottle, than a bigger one. When you lose a bottle to a leak it won't be as expensive to replace the gas!!! refer http://mykegonlegs.com.au

Consider getting a dual pressure reg. You can then have each keg and each tap on a different pressure. Cheaper to get one upfront than have to get ANOTHER reg later.

Use Valpar FlexMaster II gas/liquid line. 8mm OD 5mm ID

Consider fermenting 20-21L volumes in your fermenter. Great size to fill a 19L keg.

Get a 7$ analog bathroom skale (heh) from Ikea. Put your keg on it, zero it. Fill it up until you hit 19KG. Done.

If you're doing 20-21L batches... then you can do the batches in 20L water jerrys... which will give you about 3-4L of headspace.

If you're no chilling, then you can chill in the jerrys, and hten pitch into the jerrys. The jerry's will allow you to ferment more in the same space compared to a round barrel fermenter.

 

[Malted]

leave the man alone re brew systems. he didnt ask about brew systems, . esp not crappy Braumeisters h34r:
he asked about kegging
its not power supply, its ampage. i cant imagaine you needed a 15amp or 20amp power outlet for your PC. if you run that many urns youll be needing more ampage. i assume you can only run 2 urns from the same power point before it cuts out. if you want to use urns just power them from a differant power outlet and you wont have issues with ampage

Its not ampage, its amperage. Maybe you meant wattage? h34r:
I don't think this is a good idea. See below.

I have a 15A circuit for my PC. It's not your average PC. I usually run LN2 and some other cool bits and pieces. I draw up to 2200W+ from the wall at times and my Power Supply(s) in my PC needs to be able to produce around 90A after conversions, so yer, it's a pretty serious rig. I'm pretty sure the rest of the house is 10A, but I'll get someone in to check.

I'd rather just upgrade the kitchen to 15amp too and be done with it. I'll need to call the land lord again though... bloody pain.

2,200 watts at 240 volts is a tad over 9 amps, not 90 amps. It is unlikely that you computer would draw 21,600 watts (Watts = 90 amps x 240 volts).

Be careful about sticking two urns into different powerpoints on the same circuit.

It is common for 10 amp circuits to have a circuit breaker which is rated above 10 amps, for example 16 amps. It doesn't matter which power point you use on the same circuit, if two devices are exceeding the amperage of the circuit, then the ciruit breaker will trip. If you ran them on the same powerpoint something nasty might happen to the powerpoint. If your urn is 2, 200 watts (9 ish amps) or 2,400 watts (10 amps) then two of these devices when they are 'both on full tilt' will trip the circuit breaker. You would need to run them from different circuits, eg a circuit with its circuit breaker for 'power' to the shed, a circuit and circuit breaker for 'power' to the house and if you are lucky a second 'power' circuit and circuit breaker for the house. You may not even have a shed. It is unlikely you will be able to power 4 urns without throwing circuit breakers, or worse things happening... Not good in a rental.

You could use aluminium or stainless pots with a gas burner? Maybe you could get a 10amp 20L Braumeister, had I mentioned that?

Sorry but the 4 urns theory behind your kegging plan may not work out.
Insert smiley here because apparently you can only use a maximum of 4 in a post.

 

[vykuza]

Hey mate, shoot me an email, I've got a few bits and pieces I can give you to help you on the way.

 

[manticle]

Well, he specifically asked about 19L kegs and implied that he plans to do 4 x 10L batches.

If you have a 19L keg, then, really, unless you plan to blend everything, you should be doing 19L batches... right?

Maybe he should be looking at 9L cornies instead of 19L cornies. Then the 4 x 10 L thing makes perfect sense

 

[unco_tomato]

Hmmm, OK.

Looks like I'll just have to move up to 40L and do half batches on occasion if I want a greater variety instead of greater quantity.

Also I said the PC Power Supply needs to produce 90A not the wall outlet

Also Nick, I changed jobs in case you didn't know, I'm at Atomic now so I've lost my old email address book from PCPP (it's their intellectual property).

We can chat via TXT

 

[kymba]

if you have the capacity to do doubles/triples/quads you can make a 'base' beer that gets a bittering addition and thats it, then when you need/want to ferment them, use argon's hopping method along with steeped crystal and/or roast malts as required to make various beers using the same base

its just like tricking up a kit, except different