Biab Electric Kettle

[megs80]

Hi All,

Im in the process of building a BIAB electric setup and have added some pictures below of it in construction. Its still missing a few bits (insulation on top, false bottom and bag rack) but its still is looking like an interesting bit of kit. Check it out and if you have any comments.

Cheers
Meggs

 

[LethalCorpse]

Looks great, particularly the element - got some details on what it is and what it cost you? Shame about the brass - for the small amount you've used you could've easily gone all-stainless. How are you planning to measure/control the temperature. Plans for a sight glass? The insulation looks interesting, particularly your "bootlace" method of attachment. What's the material?

 

[Fents]

i love those new elements. my LHBS has been selling them for about a month now and he reckons they sell so well due to the fact they dont need welding and they are so simple.

 

[mxd]

looks great, if that element is 2200 watt $49 ebay joby then it might struggle to get a rolling boil. I have a 50 ltr urn and run 2 elemets for boil.

I don't have a falsie and only ever heat, whilst grain in urn, to mash out and are basically "stiring" at that point so haven't had any "burnt" tastes.

Good luck.

 

[megs80]

Looks great, particularly the element - got some details on what it is and what it cost you? Shame about the brass - for the small amount you've used you could've easily gone all-stainless. How are you planning to measure/control the temperature. Plans for a sight glass? The insulation looks interesting, particularly your "bootlace" method of attachment. What's the material?

Hey lethalcorpse,

The element is a stainless heat stick i bought jb brew supplies for $50 (aust. made). 2200 or 2400W but with a large surface area so should boil 50l well. You can find him on the net or ebay.

I know, brass. Im on a very tight budget at the moment so needed to keep it cheap. Also im not sure how well its all going to work yet so i may have to modify. A sight glass will be added along with a thermometer. Just would like to get some use to know where to put it.

Im also looking at maybe a stainless front load washer drum wrapped in material to insert to add as a mashtun in the kettle. This would allow me to used a press to squeeze out the water from my grains after mashing.

Oh yeah its a 80L stockpot from allquip.

The insulation is an interesting material. Its called eco panel and is a fibre board made from poly ethylene and is 12mm thick. Ive attached it to the kettle like a corset for easy/ quick removal if needed

Cheers,
Meggs

 

[LethalCorpse]

The large surface area is excellent, and will prevent scorching of the wort (opinions differ as to whether or not this actually occurs even with high power density elements, but it's nice to be able to avoid the issue altogether). As mxd says, it may still have difficulty boiling a full brew - the surface area doesn't affect this, all the power into the element goes into the wort whatever its size, and 2200W isn't a huge amount of power. If you haven't got a 15A outlet, or two 10A outlets on different circuits close to each other, you're limited to 2400W anyway, so there wouldn't be much you could do about it. If you are lucky enough to have access to two circuits, you may find yourself adding another one of those elephants if you struggle to hit boiling. Just means you get more drunk waiting for it on brew day, and might consequently bugger your hop additions

 

[MarkBastard]

Nice work Megs.

I've used a cheap camping matt in the same way and I have it secured using two old belts. I may think about doing what you've done with the bootlace style. Great idea.

Either that or maybe velcro.

 

[LethalCorpse]

Nice work Megs.

I've used a cheap camping matt in the same way and I have it secured using two old belts. I may think about doing what you've done with the bootlace style. Great idea.

Either that or maybe velcro.

You'd have your work cut out for you trying to do that with camping mats. You'd need to add some eyes or something so that the lacing didn't rip the foam, and you couldn't use screws (or whatever they are) like megs has done

 

[MarkBastard]

Yeah I'd probably be better off gluing on some velcro I'd say.

 

[megs80]

That seems to be the biggest unknown, wether the element will get a good rolling boil going. The insulation wont turn plastic till 150 degrees so am hoping to boil with it on. The layout has already mucked up my plans to use a counterflow chiller (will be going to a plate chiller) so adding a second element is a possibility.

 

[Thirsty Boy]

If it really is 2200W - then you wont have an issue. I have boiled a number of batches using a re-purposed 2000W element from a kettle and it hits and maintains a rolling boil with ease. Takes a while to get to said boil, but insulation on the kettle will help a lot, as will lid on while getting to the boil.. once you are there it will cruise.

My regular element is a 2400W over the side job - and its more than good enough. In fact I am trial boiling my new (60L) kettle right at this very instant - and with 50L of water in it, it is maintaining what is a just barley acceptable boil. There is good bubble formation, some of those are breaking the surface and the wort is turning over (rolling) nicely. Probably about 8% of starting volume per hour boil off rate. So just good enough - not what I would call optimum, but acceptable. And thats 50L with a single 2400W element. I will do only the occasional double batch, so it'll do for them. I know it will be significantly better in my normal 25-30L volume boil and will be testing that shortly.

So I don't think you are going to have any drama with your element, unless it behaves quite differently to the similarly powered elements I have used and use regularly.

TB

 

[goatus]

Ive got exactly the same element in my bucket o' death at the moment. Its just in an old coopers fermenter at the moment until I find a drill bit that will get through my stainless steel pot. Fermenter is not insluated at all and loses a HEAP of heat, and still got a strong rolling boil going on 28L of wort. Im sure you could get it to do double batch rolling boils with just a little bit of insulation like meggs has. (The tiles I had the bucket of death sitting on were SCOLDING hot when I moved the boiler, I think they were stealing a good whack of the energy. Perfect for me because I was wondering how I was going to control the strength of the boil, not very good for the old carbon footprint tho =)

Im really happy with the element.

Anyone know a cheapy place to source a weldless tap for when I finally get a drill through my stainless?

 

[Thirsty Boy]

Interesting - I have just been trialing my element/pot at "single" batch strength and am not getting the results I expected.

The boil vigor is more or less (a little more) the same at 30L as it was at 50L - had me scratching my head.. but I think I have worked it out. Surface area!!

50L is more liquid to boil, but about the same amount of heat is escaping through the surface in each case... so roughly the same weakish boil vigor. I was expecting better because I have boiled 30L with this element before, no issue with vigor. But - in my old pot the effective surface area was less than half of this pot. (this one is 44cm across and the old one had a hole 30cm across - 1520cm2 vs 706cm2) - Now I think that that is near enough to half - so you could bring it back by putting the lid half on, or by doing what I did which is float something on the surface. I floated 4 takeaway containers with a total surface area of 800cm2 on top of the liquid - reducing the effective surface area to about what my old pot was... and hey presto - the boil vigor suddenly started to resemble what I was used to getting.

So megs80 - I think I might have been wrong. You probably will have issues maintaining a rolling boil in that pot with that element - at 80L its going to have even more surface area than mine. BUT.... if you do somethingto reduce the effective surface area to about 700-800cm2. Then your issues will go away and the pot will boil fine.

Or perhaps figures that you work out for your own system... but thats the solution. Lid partially on - or better - something floating on the surface. A baking tray, a chunk of styrofoam covered in alfoil (which is what I am going to do) - and leave behind a small enough area so that your pot boils well.

As long as you eventually evaporate more than 8% of your starting volume (per hour) you are doing whats needed in the boil - and 700cm2 lets more than enough evaporation happen to get that easily.

Hope me working my stuff out in public helps a little

TB

PS - Goatus demonstrates the same effect with his BOD - Fermenter with an 18cm (255cm2) opening and the boil is too strong if anything

 

[megs80]

Interesting - I have just been trialing my element/pot at "single" batch strength and am not getting the results I expected.

The boil vigor is more or less (a little more) the same at 30L as it was at 50L - had me scratching my head.. but I think I have worked it out. Surface area!!

50L is more liquid to boil, but about the same amount of heat is escaping through the surface in each case... so roughly the same weakish boil vigor. I was expecting better because I have boiled 30L with this element before, no issue with vigor. But - in my old pot the effective surface area was less than half of this pot. (this one is 44cm across and the old one had a hole 30cm across - 1520cm2 vs 706cm2) - Now I think that that is near enough to half - so you could bring it back by putting the lid half on, or by doing what I did which is float something on the surface. I floated 4 takeaway containers with a total surface area of 800cm2 on top of the liquid - reducing the effective surface area to about what my old pot was... and hey presto - the boil vigor suddenly started to resemble what I was used to getting.

So megs80 - I think I might have been wrong. You probably will have issues maintaining a rolling boil in that pot with that element - at 80L its going to have even more surface area than mine. BUT.... if you do somethingto reduce the effective surface area to about 700-800cm2. Then your issues will go away and the pot will boil fine.

Or perhaps figures that you work out for your own system... but thats the solution. Lid partially on - or better - something floating on the surface. A baking tray, a chunk of styrofoam covered in alfoil (which is what I am going to do) - and leave behind a small enough area so that your pot boils well.

As long as you eventually evaporate more than 8% of your starting volume (per hour) you are doing whats needed in the boil - and 700cm2 lets more than enough evaporation happen to get that easily.

Hope me working my stuff out in public helps a little

TB

PS - Goatus demonstrates the same effect with his BOD - Fermenter with an 18cm (255cm2) opening and the boil is too strong if anything

Good info! That makes complete sense. Ill definitely reach for a roasting pan if i run into that problem.

The brew meister systems solve this problem with a funnel which reduces the outlet size to increase pressure. I think thats how lots of commercial one do it too.

I jelous ur spending the day hanging out with ur brew kettle

 

[goatus]

Thanks TB, could be useful when I make the move to my much larger surface area SS pot.

 

[thesunsettree]

Hi All,

Im in the process of building a BIAB electric setup and have added some pictures below of it in construction. Its still missing a few bits (insulation on top, false bottom and bag rack) but its still is looking like an interesting bit of kit. Check it out and if you have any comments.

Cheers
Meggs

hi megs,
how do u contol the temp, do u simply switch on and off as required or do u have a temp controller. i see jb brew supplies also sells a 16amp temp controller but i dont know if this is compatible. any thoughts?? have been able to use ur new setup yet?

cheers
matt

 

[big78sam]

I bought a cheap 30L ebay urn a while ago that had a double element. IIRC the element the large element was 1200 watt, the smaller around 800??? The larger element blew so I'm left with an urn that won’t bring 27 litres to the boil. It will keep the boil going once it's got there but I have to separate out 17 or so litres into a pot, bring to boil on the stove then add back to the urn that has brought the remaining 10 litres or so to the boil. It's a pain. We're tight for cash so I'm after a cheap way to make things easier. Would adding a standalone element to the urn like this ebay one do the job? I'm guessing so but wanted to ask others for any other bright ideas before I bought it. This will cost me just under $30 so does anyone else have any better options around the same price?


http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Electric-1200W-Imme...=item5190c929b3

Next time I'll be getting a good quality set up from the start but our finances with a new baby and the wife not working just don’t allow it.

 

[leiothrix]

If there are holes in the side of the kettle for the existing elements (or you don't mind drilling new ones), you could butcher a $10 kettle and fit the element from that. They are ~2200W and need a 1.5" hole. They come with a silicone washer to seal the hole, but you might need to make another washer to make the kettle wall thicker.

I used a bit of cut up silicone baking tray, others have just cut the plastic out of the kettle from around where the element mounts in it and used that.

HTH,
Rob.