2 Problems With Pictures.

[BennyBrewster]

ok first one, how do you guys seal up your copper joins so that they are food grade? solder ?

Joints like this:

Secondly, any ideas as to why the Co2 is coming out of my beer in the beer lines and forming Co2 gaps. The reason I ask is because when I pour the first beer the tap coughs and slutters causing the beer to foam up alot.

Maybe the fridge isnt cold enough? or my lines are to long?

See Co2 pockets:

cheers lads

 

[tangent]

is that proper beer line? it looks like beverage tubing
if it is, it'll swell and let some gas out of your beer creating pockets
the line i had fitted is really stiff and not as transparent

 

[mika]

I got proper beer line and clamps and sometimes the CO2 will come up the line, but generally it's gone in about 100mL or so.

 

[vlbaby]

benny,
You wont have an air leak that for sure. If theres any sign of a leak, you'll have beer all over the joint.
I have proper beer line on my setup, although a bit smaller diameter( 4mm ID), and i suffer a little from the same problem if the keg is allowed to sit unused for a while. However , the froth is gone in a second when the first beer is poured so its not really a bit drama.

VL.

 

[PistolPatch]

Hi Benny. If that's for a mash tun manifold, do you really need to join them anyway? You could just push the bits together when mashing and then pull them apart for cleaning.

And I have the same beer line problem as you. Let me know if you find the answer!

 

[BennyBrewster]

Cheers for the replies boys, my initial though on the Co2 pockets is that the beer in the lines is warmer than the beer in the keg (being at the bottom or the fridge) and therefore some co2 is dropping out of the beer. I will check for air leaks, though as vlbaby said I dont have any beer leaking and my regulator never shows signs of gas leakage when the bottle is left off for a few days. However like some of you said it only foams up for the first 100-200ml anyways so I guess I will live with it.

PistolPatch: The join im asking about isnt actually going to be used in my mash tun its for the pickup tube in my kettle, however that particular join in the picture is just a mockup for the photo.. I guess it wouldnt matter if it leaked except that it would break the syphon a bit higher up.

 

[Wortgames]

I don't know of anyone's tap system where the first pour doesn't foam a bit. I think it's the price you pay for having the convenience of a draught system at home.

If you use a pluto gun inside the fridge I think you can virtually eliminate it, but having a tap through the fridge means that the tap end of the line will always be warmer than the keg. The first few mls chills the tap enough that subsequent pours are usually fine.

I had a flooded font chilled with antifreeze, and I still used to get a bit of foam with that system - mind you that was about 6' away from the fridge.

If it's bad I find it easiest to rotate two glasses, running the foam into one glass before pouring a proper one. When you go for a refill you run off any foam into your now empty glass before topping up the one with the (now settled) foam in it, etc.

FWIW, to have any chance at a nice settled system, your temperature and pressure needs to have been perfectly stable for at least a week. If either of them vary you'll upset the beast.

Remeber though that even a bad draught system is better than bottling :super:

 

[oneills]

Another couple of problems worth mentioning are that your reg pressure could be a bit low depending on size of keg ,beer line diameter and length and height from keg to tap.Try increasing pressure while pouring.

The other one is what i found to be most common is over carbonated beer. When left sitting for a while the exces CO2 will come out of suspension and form bubbles in high spots in beer line.Degass keg and let sit for a few hours.

Looking at the photos i would say that because of the size of the bubbles that you should try increasing your reg pressure.

 

[mika]

Quick overview.... keg systems are very Zen, if you get yours to pour right, pour yourself a beer.
If you don't get it right.... pour yourself a slightly headier beer

 

[Kevin]

In most cases, foaming and gas pockets are due to not pushing enough pressure.

Keg systems are a balance of temperature and resistance. Oh, sure there are other factors that come into play when commercial needs are present, but for the home, they are pretty irrellevant. The only keg to keg variance that needs to be addressed is the beers' carbonation level.

The bottom line is that the pressure used to deliver the beer, less the resistance of the draft line should equal zero at the tap. This is most easily achieved when the beer line is the same temperature as the keg.

I believe that over time, the beer will continue to absorb CO2 until it achieves equalibrium with the pressure, so a good investment is a small stopcock (not a stop smallcock, which is altogether different) in line to the keg so that the gas can be quickly turned off whilst one is away. Figuring the carbonation level can be made with a chart that is widely available via internet.

The actual dispensing calculation is: Pressure = length of beer line * Line Resistance + Lift * 0.5. For simplicity sake, the homebrewers taps are the same height as the keg, so 'lift' = 0.

There are other accounts for temperature, but again, home systems tend to be so short that it is moot. You will find that after creating a balance for the line, you will need a few more tics to account for the weight of the beer.

Kev.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

With regard to the first pic


Plumbers silver solder is what you need.

A basic flux will do the job

Plumbers solders comes in a long stick about 600mm long

You will need about 5mm of solder to do that join

Plumbers like beer

Find a plumber and he will do it in about 10 seconds, but drink a 6 pack doing it.


Viva la Tradesman :super: