Yet Another 12v Pump

[Tony M]

My rig is fitted with a couple of dodgy washing machine pumps which have given many years of service and no electric shocks (surprise!). Fortunately, I burnt one out yesterday so bit the bullet and actually decided to spend money on new pumps, rather than on fuel and time, trawling the verge pick-ups.
I picked up a couple of these

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/4M-2150L-H-DC-E...#ht_6955wt_1134

and was wondering if anyone has used them. I chose them as they have oodles of capacity and variable speed and were only $66.00 with delivery from Hong Kong. They are on several US sites but the price and delivery are around $140.00.
Wish me luck.

 

[Harry Volting]

Go 'the brown' pump.
Search the forums for more info.


Hope this helps.
Harry.

 

[QldKev]

Go 'the brown' pump.
Search the forums for more info.


Hope this helps.
Harry.

Except that pump is pushing out about 10 times the flow of the brown pump

Back to OP
I haven't seen one used for brewing, I wonder if it would have the same issues as the brown pump with crap getting stuck in the rotor?

QldKev

 

[black_labb]

this one seems to have flow control via a voltage regulator which would mean there is no need for a valve after the pump.

 

[Tony M]

I haven't seen one used for brewing, I wonder if it would have the same issues as the brown pump with crap getting stuck in the rotor?

QldKev

This pump has 8X the power of the brown pump and 15mm inlet and outlet, instead of 9.5mm inlet and 6.5mm outlet for the brown, so it should be able to pump marbles.

 

[shaunous]

I've never used the brown pumps, but coming from a mechanical point of view, them pumps from the many pictures (including pump breakdown pis) and spec's i've seen look absolute rubbish.
Alot of people seem to use them though, each to there own, but I never would want to trust them...

The ebay pump your looking at looks ok, i'm guessing the black box with all the asian writing/pictures is a controller, how will you power it as its DC, battery or inverter...

Shaun...

 

[Wolfy]

Let us know how it goes, I'd be a little worried that (like the little brown pumps) the 100degC working temp they suggest might mean that it has some kind of thermal-cut-off that means you can't pump boiling water/wort around (for very long).

 

[shaunous]

I've never looked into this, but what about proper Automotive 12v/dc water pumps. They are designed to withstand high temperatures and good flow, the only thing is they are not variable, to the best of my knowledge. But I know when people who are real keen about there cars wanna get rid of the basic belt driven water pumps on there race/drag/street cars, they get a remote mounted electrical ones...

Maybe something to look into...

 

[Dan Pratt]

I think that us brewers need a middle ground pump available to run our brewery's.

Brown pumps are $30 the march pumps are $150 and as yet we're not seeing any availability for a $60 pump from a local brew store. I do apologys in advance if some one is to correct me.

I think you may be on a winner Tony, good luck.

I was looking at these as an alternative.

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/40689101...irculating.html

or these which is what you have purchased

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/46318920...tion_Speed.html

 

[dicko]

MARCH.....!!

 

[Tex083]

Looks good mate, I have heard good things about these on race cars. The Davis Craig branded ones. I believe that they are variable based on water (or wort) pump.
I will be staying tuned to see how they go! A cheap 12v power source is garden light transformers, they even come DIY ready with screw terminals

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

Check the manufacturer for food grade applications, if they dont give the ok then beware.
Nev

 

[woodwormm]

I'm sensing these may become the new 'stc1000' ... cheap and we'll all end up with a few

 

[Yorg]

Before I send an inquiry - has anyone else already done so?

Re the all black pump: Note that it is rated to 100C only in the 3phase DC version. What's 3phase DC, I don't understand their description - is it a difficult to implement?
It seems to be magnetic drive: "Drive mode: brushless, magnetic isolation" like the March, which is good for the food grade issue, depending on materials in the pump head - therefore my wanting to send an inquiry.

Re the brass one: it is not as far as I can see an isolated mag driven pump chamber - or is it, according to this description?: "Durable permanent magnetic rotor/impeller and fine ceramic shaft"

Did anyone get dimensions?

 

[Yob]

most important is to ask if they are food grade rated before all the rest become valid questions

 

[QldKev]

most important is to ask if they are food grade rated before all the rest become valid questions

Are the brown pumps actually food grade?



QldKev

 

[Dazza88]

Are the brown pumps actually food grade?




QldKev

iirc the material used is approved for food uses in the brown pump.

the plastic in this black pump is pa66. a type of nylon. a guick google suggest it can be used in food applications but no really definitive single search result. is this pump food grade? should contact the seller direct.

i dont own any pump but was considering the brown pump a while back and did research a little.

 

[Yob]

Are the brown pumps actually food grade?



QldKev

yep and the 24V ones are 12l per min... Im not seeming to have many problems with them but I also CIP while still hot so Im not sure if thats the difference or maybe Im just lucky thus far

Yob

 

[Tony M]

To answer a couple of questions

, how will you power it as its DC, battery or inverter...

I use a 6/12/24V battery charger to power the mill and mash paddle on my gear, so it will be easy to run a couple of wires to run these pumps. The only reservations are that the charger puts out 17V on the 12V setting and I dont know what that will do to that mysterious box with the chinese writing on it.

I've never looked into this, but what about proper Automotive 12v/dc water pumps.

This is sold primarily as an automotive coolant pump and a pressurised radiator can perk along at well over 100C, so i'm sure that aspect will be covered.

What's 3phase DC,

I'm no expert , but I think that little black box will switch the DC current alternately to three sets of stator windings which will give you a rotating magnetic field around the armature, so the motor is driven from the outside (stator) rather than the inside (armature). Are you as confused as I?

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

To answer a couple of questions

I use a 6/12/24V battery charger to power the mill and mash paddle on my gear, so it will be easy to run a couple of wires to run these pumps. The only reservations are that the charger puts out 17V on the 12V setting and I dont know what that will do to that mysterious box with the chinese writing on it.


This is sold primarily as an automotive coolant pump and a pressurised radiator can perk along at well over 100C, so i'm sure that aspect will be covered.


I'm no expert , but I think that little black box will switch the DC current alternately to three sets of stator windings which will give you a rotating magnetic field around the armature, so the motor is driven from the outside (stator) rather than the inside (armature). Are you as confused as I?

Thanks Tony
Some great info.
But is it food grade ?
The rest is irrelevant if you cant use it for safe brewing.
Nev

 

[Filby]

Tony is pretty close with the 3phasse DC motor description. It basically converts DC to 3phase AC and then varies the frequency of the sine wave to vary the speed of the motor. This is how inverter aircons work except it doesnt have to conver AC to DC then back to AC (like the aircon does).

Fil

 

[Yorg]

yep and the 24V ones are 12l per min... Im not seeming to have many problems with them but I also CIP while still hot so Im not sure if thats the difference or maybe Im just lucky thus far

Yob

Yeah, but as Wolfy has experienced, they cut out after running hot for some minutes.
I wonder if others have experienced this.
I need a reliable no fuss small pump - but I don't care if its AC or DC. The March is too big.

This looks like it may be OK - I'm waiting for more info from the manufacturer:
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/59582693...food_grade.html

 

[Yob]

I personally havnt had that experience. Ive had one on the HLT (12v) for almost 12 months, probably oven a dozen HERMS brews without issue... Well except when i decided to open it to have a look, maybe clean... and broke it

Very interested to see if those linked above are fg looks like a tight unit.

 

[Tony M]

the plastic in this black pump is pa66. a type of nylon. a guick google suggest it can be used in food applications but no really definitive single search result. is this pump food grade? should contact the seller direct.

I had a stooge around too, Dazdog and found nothing specific. However, several suppliers did say it was safe. The best I saw was this one from a filter supplier and as far as I'm concerned, if they can filter my blood thru it, it will handle my beer.

"PA66 nylon filter mesh media (21)
Medicinal filter mesh (2)
Liquid medicine filter mesh (1)
Blood transfusion filter mesh (1)
tea bag,coffee mill filter mesh media (1)
Automobile fuel pump filter mesh media (1)
other uses. filter mesh(Flour sieving,food,chemistry,printing...etc) (17)"

 

[Truman42]

Yeah, but as Wolfy has experienced, they cut out after running hot for some minutes.
I wonder if others have experienced this.
I need a reliable no fuss small pump - but I don't care if its AC or DC. The March is too big.

This looks like it may be OK - I'm waiting for more info from the manufacturer:
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/59582693...food_grade.html

See this post here for why they can sometimes cut out once they get hot and what you can do about it. At first I thought it was some sort of thermal cut out but I had run this pump with clean boiling water through it a couple of times before with no problems.
It cut out on 3 occasions at mash out temps and I think it was just the heat causing tighter tolerances combined with the dried up crud in the bush which was pushing the shaft and magnet against the body of the pump casuing it to stop.


I havent had any problems with my brown pump since pulling it apart and giving it a good clean out, doing a hot CIP after every brew and running the pump with the body upright above the inlet/outlet. Ive pumped 90C water through it to clean and it has run for 20 mins plus like this.

Brown pump problems

 

[Yob]

Im not convinced, just coz a supplier says "she'll be right" is different than a manufacturer stating food grade..

The plastic might well be fine but i dont think they pump blood at 100'c do they?

Automotive pumps? When was the last time you drank from the radiator?

Im not trying to be deliberately objectionable moreover cautious.. Id like to get the manufacturers opinion on food grade before i forked out for one... Just as i did with the brown pumps..

 

[Yorg]

I've just purchased a 'sample' of the pump linked on post #22.
The MP 15RM model.

$48 for the pump, $54 delivery costs. No doubt would be less for a bulk buy.
Should get it in days.
Will let you know what its like.

 

[QldKev]

I've just purchased a 'sample' of the pump linked on post #22.
The MP 15RM model.

$48 for the pump, $54 delivery costs. No doubt would be less for a bulk buy.
Should get it in days.
Will let you know what its like.

Looks like one of these

 

[woodwormm]

I've just purchased a 'sample' of the pump linked on post #22.
The MP 15RM model.

$48 for the pump, $54 delivery costs. No doubt would be less for a bulk buy.
Should get it in days.
Will let you know what its like.

Yorg,

I've always been scared off by Alibaba, i thought it was only for importers/wholesalers etc who wanted to buy thousands of units....

did you buy your one 'sample' through that link?

any special skills/language required to do so?

there's so many products come up in searches from Alibaba that i'd like....

 

[Yorg]

Yorg,

I've always been scared off by Alibaba, i thought it was only for importers/wholesalers etc who wanted to buy thousands of units....

did you buy your one 'sample' through that link?

any special skills/language required to do so?

there's so many products come up in searches from Alibaba that i'd like....

No problem so far at all, couple of emails and was able to paypal. Also check out Alibaba express, they seemed to have almost all the same products but selling single items.
http://www.aliexpress.com