Wit: Adjunct Decoction Mash, Recipe, Water

[jonw]

Hello folks,

I had a listen to the Brewing Network podcast on Belgian Wit - it's given me a few ideas I'm interested in. I'd appreciate your opinions on this recipe and mash schedule.

I'm looking at the following grist (for a 25L batch):-

3.5Kg Pilsner
2.0Kg Torrified Wheat
0.5Kg Rice Hulls
0.25Kg Flaked Oats

Jamil recommends a separate mash for the (finely ground!) adjuncts (which I take to be the unmalted what and the oats) with a 15min rest at 50C, a 15min rest at 66C, and then boil for 15min. At this point, the adjunct 'decoction' is added to the main mash which has been resting at 50C, to bring it up to a rest at 66C. Rest there for 45min then mash out.

Has anybody tried this mash schedule? I'm particularly interested in any experience comparing this to a straight stepped infusion (or decoction) mash. If you have tried it, how did you work out the water:grain ratios for both main and adjunct mashes so that returning the decoction to the main mash brings you to rest at 66C?

Jamil recommends a 90min boil, bittering at 80min, and then flavouring at 10min (IIRC) to about 20IBUs. I'm going to be using NZ Goldings and B Saaz (as the result of a separate thread) with about 35g and 30g respectively, and I've made wits before bittered to that level and been pleased with the result.

The tricky bit's with the other bittering/flavour additions! In the last wit I made, I added 15g 50/50 dried bitter curacao orange peel and sweet orange peel, half at 15min half at 5min. I couldn't taste it in the resulting beer, so I'm thinking of adding the same amount but at 30min, working on the basis that it'
ll have longer to extract the oil from the peel. I'm aiming for a Hoegaarden level and spiciness and fruitiness. Jamil says he's adding heaps of fresh zest at flameout - wouldn't that completely overpower everything else?! He also adds coriander and chamomile at flameout. If you've achieved a Hoegaarden-like beer, I'm keen to hear from you.

Finally, I have soft water in Sydney. Should I just add a little Calcium Chloride to bring up the Calcium ion level and reduce pH?

Cheers,

Jon

 

[AndrewQLD]

I think you are boiling the peel too long, once the orange peel hits the boiling wort you start extracting the oil flavours and aromas. After a very short boil the oils will have all boiled off and you will pretty much have nothing left. I add my peel additions at 5 minutes from flame out, same goes for my corriander and I can always perceive the orange in the finished beer.

I've never added oats to my wit, but have seen some recipes with it in, what is the purpose of the oats?

Again I'm not sure why you would need to do a seperate mash with the adjuncts, seems like a lot of work to me, If you are going to do that I would add a kilo of the malt grain as well to get the adjuncts converting as well.
Chamomile "YAK" not in a wit for me.

The hops sound good.

Jamil may be a prize winning brewer but I find his style of brewing a little complicated and overdone.
Here's my recipe for comparison WIT

Andrew

 

[jonw]

Chamomile "YAK" not in a wit for me.

Thanks Andrew, I think I'll stick with a single mash, with a rest at 50C for 20min, a rest at 66C for 60min, and mash out for 10. I've yet to do the maths, but I hope I can fit that into my tun with an infusion - otherwise I'll be trying my first decoction! What would be a good water:grain ratio for the 50C step i.e. I want to keep it thick to keep the later volumes down, but not so think that it doesn't do any good. I might just aim for 3:1 at the 66C step and work backwards.

I'm using dried peel, so I guess I'll need to soak it for a while before adding it to the boil, and then just add for the last 5 mins as you say. The oats are for mouth feel apparently - I've never made a wit without them, so I can't comment on their effectiveness.

Cheers,

Jon

 

[AndrewQLD]

Jon'

I work out 2.5l/kilo for the 52 rest and then up that to 4l/kilo of 93 water for the 66 rest. For my system that works out to be :
15 lt @ 56=52
9 lt @ 93=66

However your temps would be slightly different for your system I would think. I'd just throw the dried peel in as is, You shouldn't need to soak them, I normally use fresh peel so maybe someone else can comment on the dried stuff?

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Hoops]

Jon,

I have done a separate mash for the adjuncts, for either an oatmeal stout or a wit, can't remember it was that long ago.
The advantage of doing this is that it completely gelatinises the starches, and if you put a little malted barley in there, it will also thin out the thick gooey stuff and start to break the starches down. It also helps heaps if you stir it alot, as I beleive the shear force assists in the process. As far as temp and ratio.......it was all the adjunct, a handfull or 2 of grain, enough water to make it stir-able and a bit of heat. (I know I know, I'm so precise.) From what I remember I was very happy with the results.


Andrew
Why add oats? - reading from my book here: "they have a large fraction of gums and proteins and build up the body of the beer and enhance it's smoothness".
Personally I found they give a smooth, silky, slightly oily type of mouthfeel. I really like it and add it to my oatmeal stout and wits.


As far as the orange peel goes, do you guys use of the shelf oranges?? I am worried about pesticides as I imagine they would be on, and absorbed into the skin as the skin is never intended to be eaten so I think levels of pesticides wouldn't normally be under scrutiny of regulatory authorities??

EDIT -I have used fresh orange peel, as well as mandarin peel in vodka, and in both cases it tastes great!

Hoops

 

[AndrewQLD]

Nice to see you back on line and brewing Hoops.

Good explanation on the oats, I do use them in a Stout I make for just the reasons you have stated. But I can't see why they would be needed in a Wit, but again it's Horses for courses.

I use the shelf oranges from the supermarket, normally the greenish ones, Navel I think. I'd be just as worried what is being sprayed on the packet stuff as well, I'm sure there're just as susceptible to insects. And I'd be even more worried what's on the peel from the local Asian store as well.


Cheers
Andrew