Where would the new Australian Ales fit into Competitions?

[Bribie G]

I don't mind a swift 150 Lashes or two while I'm waiting for the bus home and the odd Nine Tails hits the spot as well. With more Aussie micros (and not-so-micros) getting into Ales it strikes me that there's no really appropriate BJCP classes to enter one's own attempts at these increasingly popular styles.

Easy, just enter them as American Pale Ales? Well as James Squire website says re the 150:

We have been looking to introduce an Australian style Pale Ale to the James Squire range for some time to provide a flip side to our quite challenging English style India Pale Ale (IPA), Stowaway. We did not want to go the big overtly hoppy American Pale Ale route, (which we’ve already done quite successfully with three Hop Thief releases) for this new beer, as we are aiming to provide an entry point for drinkers who are just beginning to explore the more interesting beer flavours on offer within the craft beer market.

Current BJCP guidelines suggest: A mild but distinctive peppery, herbaceous flavour from Pride of Ringwood hops is desirable.

Which covers the Coopers styles of course but what if we want to use some NS or Galaxy etc. and I'm sure there will be people out there who are perfecting their own 150 lash or Stone and Wood or White Rabbit tributes and would love to showcase them in comps.

I wonder if any new styles are being considered for the comps in the near future? Edit: or a broadening of the AusPA style guidelines? Currently, to turn it on its head, it's a bit like a hypothetical situation where BJCP is actually an Australian based Organisation and we mandate that all American Pale Ales entered in the USA competitions have to conform to a profile similar to SNPA, no other styles considered.

 

[QldKev]

The AABC has specified some, that I tend to use

http://www.aabc.org.au/docs/

This doc is pretty useful
AABC2012StyleGuidelines-Final 1Mar.pdf

 

[Bribie G]

Yes, fine if you are brewing a Coopers Clone - the current AABC guidelines are just Coopers Coopers Coopers.

 

[fletcher]

it seems strange/interesting to me that it pigeonholes australian pale ales to pride of ringwood; a single hop. it uses the term 'citrusy' for american pales though which can include a much greater variety.

 

[beerdrinkingbob]

Not having a crack Bribie but Coopers isn't even up to it, looks like CUB megaswill or nothing


Ingredients: Australian 2-row lager malt. Restrained use of crystal malt for colour and flavour. Substantial
proportion of cane sugar, typically around 30%, for light body and signature fermentation profile. Pride of
Ringwood hops, bittering addition only. CUB ale yeast or similar. Attenuative English or American strains most
suitable. Note: Whitelabs WLP009 Australian Ale yeast (Coopers strain) is unsuitable. Variable water profile, soft
Pilsen type preferred.

 

[Charst]

I agree Australian pale ale should be broader than Coopers but the same as Californian Common is the Anchor Steam the widening of the style needs to not loose its own origin to an extent.

 

[Bribie G]

Not having a crack Bribie but Coopers isn't even up to it, looks like CUB megaswill or nothing


Ingredients: Australian 2-row lager malt. Restrained use of crystal malt for colour and flavour. Substantial
proportion of cane sugar, typically around 30%, for light body and signature fermentation profile. Pride of
Ringwood hops, bittering addition only. CUB ale yeast or similar. Attenuative English or American strains most
suitable. Note: Whitelabs WLP009 Australian Ale yeast (Coopers strain) is unsuitable. Variable water profile, soft
Pilsen type preferred.

Bob where did you get that from? The current AABC guidelines are different, you may have an old Aussie lager specs there, not the Pale Ale?

 

[jyo]

I agree, the style needs broadening. "Pacific Ale" would be a good sub strand for Aussie Pales, I reckon. That way it can allow for the use of our new hop varieties, including the use of Kiwi hops if desired.

Old idea, but see here- http://www.brewsnews.com.au/2010/12/a-rose-by-any-other-name/

 

[bradsbrew]

Bob where did you get that from? The current AABC guidelines are different, you may have an old Aussie lager specs there, not the Pale Ale?

Section 8. 2012 guidelines.
8.1 Australian bitter ale

 

[Charst]

I agree, the style needs broadening. "Pacific Ale" would be a good sub strand for Aussie Pales, I reckon. That way it can allow for the use of our new hop varieties, including the use of Kiwi hops if desired.

Old idea, but see here- http://www.brewsnews.com.au/2010/12/a-rose-by-any-other-name/

Pacific ale is good but i dont see much definition between a Pacific ale and an APA. not in the hop profile at least. I problem is all these new varieties of hops may be local but the style to me still mimics the american hop market.

americans created something new with their hops, beers and styles followed. im not sure were doing that over here.

 

[Nick JD]

Not having a crack Bribie but Coopers isn't even up to it, looks like CUB megaswill or nothing


Ingredients: Australian 2-row lager malt. Restrained use of crystal malt for colour and flavour. Substantial
proportion of cane sugar, typically around 30%, for light body and signature fermentation profile. Pride of
Ringwood hops, bittering addition only. CUB ale yeast or similar. Attenuative English or American strains most
suitable. Note: Whitelabs WLP009 Australian Ale yeast (Coopers strain) is unsuitable. Variable water profile, soft
Pilsen type preferred.

WTF? The only commercial version of the style's yeast ... is unsuitable?

 

[AndrewQLD]

Good point Charst, it's more like James Squire are brewing and mimicking American and English styles and trying to market them as new Australian styles in order to gain a wider appeal.

 

[manticle]

The US didn't really make their own stuff up from scratch though - they took existing ideas and added some of their own ingredients and own interpretations to make them bigger and bolder. A lot of US craft brewing has origins in British and Belgian brewing styles, recipes and techniques.

We either go back to our brewing roots (which will also have british origins but using indigenous ingredients) or we take existing ideas and give them our own spin. Nothing wrong with influences - cultural evolution is almost impossible without them.

 

[Bribie G]

Yes, as the BJCP guide says for American Pale Ales - which only date from the 1970s:

History:
An American adaptation of English pale ale, reflecting
indigenous ingredients (hops, malt,
yeast, and water). Often lighter
in colour, cleaner in fermentation by-products, and having less
caramel flavours than
English counterparts.

And as for Australian Bitter Ale, I don't know how that got sneaked in a couple of years ago, I doubt if such a thing ever existed, at least not after most Aussies went Lager around the beginning of the 20th Century.

 

[TidalPete]

That's the way I've always read it Andrew. Those colonial beer names are catchy but.

Good point Charst, it's more like James Squire are brewing and mimicking American and English styles and trying to market them as new Australian styles in order to gain a wider appeal.

 

[bconnery]

Australian Bitter Ale is not the same as Australian Pale Ale, AABC wise
The paragraph quoted with the reference to Coopers not being suitable is only going to confuse that side of the debate.
As to where these new pale ales fit, Specialty Class, until such time as they've decided they are a class of their own. I've heard the term New World Pale being bandied about elsewhere but I don't think anythings been adapted anywhere yet...

 

[Bribie G]

Of course it's not just us, if anything the Kiwis have it all over us with many of their micros. The home brew community is a lot smaller as the whole country is only around the size of an Aussie State but I expect there as well, their pale ales are generally made on domestic malt and overwhelming use of their own hops - so writing off their efforts as being pale shadows of the almighty American Pale Ale would be even more irritating to them. Might hop onto one of their forums and see what their thoughts are.

 

[beerdrinkingbob]

Sorry to mislead you Bribie, it appears I had my man eyes on and scrolled one page to far....

 

[Bribie G]

Panic over Bob ... CUB Ale Yeast???? :blink: might be easier to find Unicorn Milk or Mermaid Tears