When a H.B. Shop should say "Kits and Bits" only!

[SJW]

I got to tell someone this story. I went to A local H.B. Shop just then to pick up some low alpha noble hops to bitter a Vienna I am doing on the weekend. I normally get EVERYTHING from Brewman on-line. Anyway I thought I had some Hallertau at home but I did not. So I have been into this guy a bit of late to help a bloke at work get started with kits and he keeps banging on how he has grain and hops and can clone any recipe blah blah blah.
So I dropped in to ask for 40g of Hallertau and also did he know the alpha Acid %. He looked at me and said, did I need to know exact or just roughly? So many things went through my head at once I was speechless. He said it should be between 2.5 and 5.5% but its not the German one. Then asked what it was for. I said an All Grain Vienna, he then suggested Northern brewer......... Still speechless I got my 40g of ......Hall.... and left.
I did say to him "how do people know how much hops to buy if you cant tell them the A/A %" then he was speechless as I left never to return.

Steve

 

[Bribie G]

I'm sure he'd be able to tell you the difference between flavouring essences for Scotch or Bourbon.

I'm surprised your LHBS stocks hops, most of them do the hop teabags that are usually on a display out of the fridge. My favourite LHBS quote was from a guy on the Sunshine Coast, popped in to try and get some Morgans Lager Yeast when I was on holiday there, he only had Brew Cellar lager yeast, and on enquiring about what strain it was he gave me a lecture on the known fact that there are only four strains of brewing yeast in the whole World.

Well I never knew that, good information.

 

[SJW]

Yeah, he has the tea bags and stuff. I think he is trying to cover all brewing bases but he is well out of his depth.

 

[crowmanz]

I'm surprised your LHBS stocks hops, most of them do the hop teabags that are usually on a display out of the fridge.

Luckily my LHBS has dry yeast in the fridge but only Safale/lager/brew I think they stock some others but they are on the shelf along with the hop tea bags.

 

[antiphile]

It'd be funny if it weren't true, SJW. There are only 2 that I know of around Newcastle itself now; one at Charlestown and one at Islington. And the really depressing thing is, that tale of woe could well apply to either of them.

 

[SJW]

It'd be funny if it weren't true, SJW. There are only 2 that I know of around Newcastle itself now; one at Charlestown and one at Islington. And the really depressing thing is, that tale of woe could well apply to either of them.

Yeah, maybe I should have gone up to ......... (I better not say) h34r:

 

[Alex.Tas]

I got to tell someone this story. I went to A local H.B. Shop just then to pick up some low alpha noble hops to bitter a Vienna I am doing on the weekend. I normally get EVERYTHING from Brewman on-line. Anyway I thought I had some Hallertau at home but I did not. So I have been into this guy a bit of late to help a bloke at work get started with kits and he keeps banging on how he has grain and hops and can clone any recipe blah blah blah.
So I dropped in to ask for 40g of Hallertau and also did he know the alpha Acid %. He looked at me and said, did I need to know exact or just roughly? So many things went through my head at once I was speechless. He said it should be between 2.5 and 5.5% but its not the German one. Then asked what it was for. I said an All Grain Vienna, he then suggested Northern brewer......... Still speechless I got my 40g of ......Hall.... and left.
I did say to him "how do people know how much hops to buy if you cant tell them the A/A %" then he was speechless as I left never to return.

Steve

Sounds like Bribie might be on the money with the remark about knowing more about the spirit additives.

I imagine the margins are pretty low in home brew supply stores and it is incredibly tough to run one when you are competing against online shops that can deliver the goods without the overheads involved with operating a traditional shop. I'll admit i have no real idea as to what percentage of sales made in lhbs are made to all grain brewers, or at least brewers who aren't just using kit + kilo. But i would imagine it isn't a large percentage. (would be awesome if a retailer on here could drop some rough figures in here).
If the demand for knowledge beyond Kit and Kilo isn't high enough, then the store may not (unfortunately for all grain brewers) see the value in seeking staff with more in depth knowledge.
Attracting the right staff who have the knowledge could also be tough too, perhaps you spoke with a rookie at the store? It would be a shame if you didn't ever go there again based on this particular visit.

I'll admit i don't always shop local, but its always good to head into your local store and support them where you can. I suppose I'm lucky that we have an awesome home brew shop in Hobart with super helpful staff and competitive (if not better) prices than what is available online.

It would be a shame if Newcastle only had one home brew store.

 

[warra48]

gave me a lecture on the known fact that there are only four strains of brewing yeast in the whole World.

Well I never knew that, good information.

Simple facts for even simpler minds.....

 

[SJW]

Sounds like Bribie might be on the money with the remark about knowing more about the spirit additives.

I imagine the margins are pretty low in home brew supply stores and it is incredibly tough to run one when you are competing against online shops that can deliver the goods without the overheads involved with operating a traditional shop. I'll admit i have no real idea as to what percentage of sales made in lhbs are made to all grain brewers, or at least brewers who aren't just using kit + kilo. But i would imagine it isn't a large percentage. (would be awesome if a retailer on here could drop some rough figures in here).
If the demand for knowledge beyond Kit and Kilo isn't high enough, then the store may not (unfortunately for all grain brewers) see the value in seeking staff with more in depth knowledge.
Attracting the right staff who have the knowledge could also be tough too, perhaps you spoke with a rookie at the store? It would be a shame if you didn't ever go there again based on this particular visit.

I'll admit i don't always shop local, but its always good to head into your local store and support them where you can. I suppose I'm lucky that we have an awesome home brew shop in Hobart with super helpful staff and competitive (if not better) prices than what is available online.

It would be a shame if Newcastle only had one home brew store.

We had one of the best in the business, MHB Marks Homebrew, from memory he gave away selling the kits and essences as there was so little money to be made from them, when people could go to Coles or K Mart and buy the kits for not much less than he bought them for. Anyway he sold the business to Steve "Brewman" who is a little out of town but like Mark has an excellent knowledge of grain brewing and only sells All Grain Supplies. While we would all love a quality shop front homebrew shop close by, the reality is they must not be a viable money making concern.

 

[blotto]

While we would all love a quality shop front homebrew shop close by, the reality is they must not be a viable money making concern.

Most home brewers (Myself included) are always hunting for a bargain, cheaper prices and arranging bulk buys, we're inherently bad for small businesses running on tight margins IMO.

 

[earle]

LHBS's can't compete on price selling the same kits as the supermarkets. If they can offer good advice though, people will pay the extra to buy from somewhere they can get good advice and have a yarn with someone knowledgeable about brewing. Combine higher prices with no knowledge and you've got a losing combination.

 

[Barge]

Luckily my LHBS is craftbrewer! Capalaba for the win!

 

[Weizguy]

Yeah, maybe I should have gone up to ......... (I better not say) h34r:

I feel you were going to say East Maitland... I'm sure Brewman would not be too upset with you, considering the circumstances.

We had one of the best in the business, MHB Marks Homebrew, from memory he gave away selling the kits and essences as there was so little money to be made from them, when people could go to Coles or K Mart and buy the kits for not much less than he bought them for. Anyway he sold the business to Steve "Brewman" who is a little out of town but like Mark has an excellent knowledge of grain brewing and only sells All Grain Supplies. While we would all love a quality shop front homebrew shop close by, the reality is they must not be a viable money making concern.

I actually visited Steve today (not too far from my house @ Medowie), and he does have a range of liquid and dry extracts, so not limited to grain, but mostly for brewers with a boiler anyway.
I plan to buy some Briess liquid wheat extract from him soon, for an easy brewday with a mate from work.

 

[Vini2ton]

Like most people, I don't expect to be bullshitted to by someone who really doesn't know their stuff and just pretend they do. I find that now in most retail that if people can't answer your question, they just make shit up. Don't get me started.

 

[antiphile]

The Novocastrians who regularly shop locally (and I know a few), seem to have very little knowledge, unfortunately. I honestly just can't bring myself to do it since Mark closed (and I'm excluding the other that SJW said was a little out of town).

Shop 1: Is owned by a husband/wife team. Dry yeast has never seen the inside of a fridge, and liquid yeast doesn't exist. I went in one day wanting S23. I inconvenienced the wife asking for it because she (the only one in the shop), had to go to all the trouble of saving the computer game she was playing, before she could serve me. "No, they don't make that anymore" was the reply. "Let's see what they recommend now. Ahh, here it is. Mangrove Jacks Bohemian Lager". I shoot you not! I really should have picked that up as a huge red sign, but a few months later I went back because it was so convenient to my place. She had progressed to some other computer game and hubby again not to be found. Damn! (Of course, this was several years ago and I hadn't learned the ncessity to keep good stocks properly on-hand at home). "Ahhh. sorry to disturb you from your important work." I was wanting some medium crystal for an extract at that time. "Do you keep grain in stock?" "Yes, we have all three!" Huh? "We have this one called crystal, and I think there's normal crystal. And the other one, let me check. Oh yeah, we have roasted". She walked to the back of the shop-front, and in open halves of cardboard boxes, were 2 opened grey (Coles-type) plastic shopping bags, and one opened clear plastic bag, sitting directly on the floor under some shelves. I thanked her and told her it wasn't what I was after and walked out. never been back.

Shop 2: only marginally better. Yeast kept on front counter, but at least some of the hops are kept in a tiny freezer compartment in a normal domestic fridge. However, they do sometimes offer a taster of a homebrew on tap that is kept in the main part of the fridge. And, you don't feel as though you are necessarily going to get hepatitis by walking in, so that's a plus. There's a range of about 4 or 5 specialty malts but really only designed for Kits, and probably 5 or 6 types of hops with half of them refridgerated. But, a great place if you want to buy cheese making equipment or making your own beef jerky.

Sorry all, but I don't think it would be a loss if both had to close down. I just can't bring myself to get anything from them, and in an emergency it looks like a 90 min round trip to Brewman might be needed.

 

[SBOB]

I feel you were going to say East Maitland... I'm sure Brewman would not be too upset with you, considering the circumstances.

While I do prefer Brewman, Digga at Country Brewer in East Maitland does have an decent setup compared to the two in Newcastle and with their 10% store credit it softens some of the slightly expensive yeast/hop pricing...but they do have a decent selection of hops and dry/wyeast in their fridge
Their 25kg sacks of basic base malt (like JW Ale and Pilsner) for $60 are good value ($54 considering you get 10% as credit for the next time), but their pre-packaged hops arent the cheapest and no 'off the shelf' option for specialty grains that aren't pre-cracked and pre-packaged does make them a less ideal choice than Brewman for all grain supplies

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

In all honesty, there are just not enough AG/BIAB brewers around to warrant a small HB shop keeping dedicated supplies for them.

Why, as a shop owner would you keep a stock of liquid yeast if you probably only sell 2 -3 per year, and then cop flock for it being old and out of date

 

[Fylp]

Shit! I never realised how spoiled I am living 5min from ESB.

 

[Mr B]

In all honesty, there are just not enough AG/BIAB brewers around to warrant a small HB shop keeping dedicated supplies for them.

Why, as a shop owner would you keep a stock of liquid yeast if you probably only sell 2 -3 per year, and then cop flock for it being old and out of date

That is true. And brewers of whatever ilk are quite rare.

A mate of mine, despite all my 'fantastic' advice, apparently makes beer of a somewhat mouldy ilk.

He has given up.

The other brewers I have known over the last 15 years are but two in person, both making beer, one of a dubious quality.

It take some reading and investment to make good beer (without boast, my beer is regarded as good), most dont make the investment.

Hence the investment in ingredients is small.

To get to make good beer, the investment is generally significant. In both gear and knowledge.

If you read a bit, it is generally not local both due to availability and price.

So, living in a regional town, I think I am trying to get that you farkers with cheap ingredients and gear sark!

Heh

But I spread the wealth, give away heaps of beers, keep the dream (or the lawn chunder cause its usually IPA, need to make some mids for the XXXXX)

Edit: But it is important to support the local brew suppliers where you can, especially with bulk grain, which I do. BTW, My local Craftbrewer is a champion establishment, all sacks of grain and yeast packs (admittedly subsequently propagated) are local.

 

[SJW]

The Novocastrians who regularly shop locally (and I know a few), seem to have very little knowledge, unfortunately. I honestly just can't bring myself to do it since Mark closed (and I'm excluding the other that SJW said was a little out of town).
Shop 1: Is owned by a husband/wife team. Dry yeast has never seen the inside of a fridge, and liquid yeast doesn't exist. I went in one day wanting S23. I inconvenienced the wife asking for it because she (the only one in the shop), had to go to all the trouble of saving the computer game she was playing, before she could serve me. "No, they don't make that anymore" was the reply. "Let's see what they recommend now. Ahh, here it is. Mangrove Jacks Bohemian Lager". I shoot you not! I really should have picked that up as a huge red sign, but a few months later I went back because it was so convenient to my place. She had progressed to some other computer game and hubby again not to be found. Damn! (Of course, this was several years ago and I hadn't learned the ncessity to keep good stocks properly on-hand at home). "Ahhh. sorry to disturb you from your important work." I was wanting some medium crystal for an extract at that time. "Do you keep grain in stock?" "Yes, we have all three!" Huh? "We have this one called crystal, and I think there's normal crystal. And the other one, let me check. Oh yeah, we have roasted". She walked to the back of the shop-front, and in open halves of cardboard boxes, were 2 opened grey (Coles-type) plastic shopping bags, and one opened clear plastic bag, sitting directly on the floor under some shelves. I thanked her and told her it wasn't what I was after and walked out. never been back.
Shop 2: only marginally better. Yeast kept on front counter, but at least some of the hops are kept in a tiny freezer compartment in a normal domestic fridge. However, they do sometimes offer a taster of a homebrew on tap that is kept in the main part of the fridge. And, you don't feel as though you are necessarily going to get hepatitis by walking in, so that's a plus. There's a range of about 4 or 5 specialty malts but really only designed for Kits, and probably 5 or 6 types of hops with half of them refridgerated. But, a great place if you want to buy cheese making equipment or making your own beef jerky.
Sorry all, but I don't think it would be a loss if both had to close down. I just can't bring myself to get anything from them, and in an emergency it looks like a 90 min round trip to Brewman might be needed.

Yup, +1 to all the above.
I think there are home brewers and home brewers. So many guys I know say "oh yeah I brew too" with the cheapest out of date kit and 1 or 2 kgs of CSR sugar and ferment on a heat pad all year round. I have learnt just to nod my head and agree. I have pointed a few to my YouTube brew videos on BigTed ManShed and that's the last I hear from them.
I am putting the time into a guy at work who just put down his second kit + kg but unless you are self motivated to learn the basic science it's very draining to teach someone the art of beer.

Ps. I forgot about the East Maitland brew shop, is it a Countey Brewer? Might check it out. Brewman is still the best though.