Vert Wyrt Wrt Or Wort

[kieran]

Hi all.

I wrongly pronounce Wort as it looks. I know most pronounce it wrt.. (phonetically wert).
That's cool and all, but after living with a german for 2 years, i know they wouldnt pronounce it 'wert'.. It would be pronounced 'vert'.
But that's assuming that the 'o' is pronounced as an 'oe' because it is of german origin (the oe is a way of spelling an umlaut typset o, ie. ) .
But then I saw somewhere that in old English it was Wyrt. Now that would make sense from both a spelling and phonetic pronunciation standpoint.

Anyway, can anyone shed any light on the subject. I'm curious.

Cheers
Kieran

 

[Lecterfan]

There are almost certainly bound to be many linguistic/etymological specialists out there, but my experiences in other fields has been that 'Old English', a.k.a. Anglo-Saxon is largely Germanic/Teutonic in origin thus wyrt/wort (with the umlaut I don't know how to type) is not much more than a regional difference and would have little impact on pronunciation. The 'y' in Anglo-Saxon spelling largely plays the role of a number of vowel-consonants combos or singulars, depending on its context, but in a capitalised form such as 'Ye Old...' it actually is more likely to be representing a bastardisation of the rune from the 'futhark' which represents 'th' (thus 'The Old...' rather than 'Ye Old...'), Airgead may well know more about that (wiki has some stuff on the the 'thorn' rune). Bearing in mind this teutonic link, the 'w' of wyrt would almost certainly be pronounced 'v'yrt back in the day, but then also bear in mind that the huge impact of Anglo-Saxon culture (linguistically - but it can't be underestimated, it is the main etymological source of our day to day English, outdone possibly only by Latin which it often shares anyway) only happened over a relatively brief period of time before the Normanisation (for want of a better term) of things (when, for example, we made a distinction between cow and beef, due to the introduction of the Franko-Norman 'boeuf' to the language). People often scoff at the difficulty and inconsistency of the English language, but it actually reflects a rich cultural melting pot of the Northern European dialects, and allows us infinite nuance for those who give a ****.

One of my supervisors is german, and she is happy to use (phonetically) 'vert', and I see no reason to quibble at this term...but when I'm on the phone to a friend we often say 'wart' and neither of us miss a beat.


YMMV, as they say. :icon_cheers:

edit: I feel incredibly foolish if this is an in-joke, elbow-in-the-ribs, wink wink type situation...in which case I have fallen prey and have hopefully provided much eye-rolling amusement.

 

[Nick JD]

I'm not sure how to say, "Kieran".

Is it kay-ran, or key-ran or keer-an, or kee-ren?

 

[Bribie G]

ve haf vays

 

[Florian]

In German it's Wrze [ˈvʏrt͜sə] or more specific Bierwrze [ˈbiːɐ̯vʏrt͜sə], so the old English Wyrt is probably closest, but is missing the second syllable.

In English I pronounce it wrt (like 'word' but with a t instead of d), not because I know that that's how it's pronounced but because that's the way I picked it up from others. A friend of mine who used to work in a brewery a decade or so ago pronounces it wort as in sword, again with a t and obviously without the s.

 

[Nick JD]

I've noticed the use of the "correct" pronounciation is largely weighted on the wankiness of the subject.

We don't say fee-lay (fillet), but we say bell-ay (ballet).

It's ****** wort. Like the Witch's face. Poofs.

 

[kelbygreen]

I always got pulled up in english! the teacher would pick out my words and say that letter is silent!, Well if its silent why the **** is it in there??? like knife nife, elephant elifant. I spelt the words out how they sounded its not my fault some stupid **** made letters silent lol or if you put a e at the end the whole word sounded different!

 

[sim]

I've noticed the use of the "correct" pronounciation is largely weighted on the wankiness of the subject.

We don't say fee-lay (fillet), but we say bell-ay (ballet).

It's ****** wort. Like the Witch's face. Poofs.

no thanks, wort rhymes with skirt for me. not so hard to do.

 

[Wolfy]

We don't say fee-lay (fillet)

... OK then, what's this?

Fillet Minion?
Fee-lay Min-yon?

 

[felten]

fill it mig non

I say wert, only because I was told that's how its pronounced when I started out

 

[Truman42]

While were on the subject is it troob or trub.

And is hefeweizen heffa wizzen heffa weezen heffe wyzen (Ive heard it pronounced all 3.)

Potato Potarto, Tomato tomarto?? Its all so confusing...

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

While we're there... (or is it Wile where their?), what about Reinheitsgebot ?

I don't think I'll worry too much. I totally stuff up the pronunciation when I pronounce it "German purity law"....even worse when I am drunk and pronounce it "German's scared to put some bloody adjuncts and spices in their beer law".

 

[Dave70]

Sugaz?

Rice gulls?

 

[glenwal]

Kitten or Kitton?

 

[Dave70]

fcuk or f**k?

 

[MHB]

I was told by an IBD master brewer, quite emphatically that its pronounced wert, Ill take the opinion of a brewer with 50 years experience, a PhD equivalent in brewing and who has personal experience brewing on 5 continents at face value.
Mark

 

[spudfarmerboy]

I was told by an IBD master brewer, quite emphatically that its pronounced wert, Ill take the opinion of a brewer with 50 years experience, a PhD equivalent in brewing and who has personal experience brewing on 5 continents at face value.
Mark

Thats it, its all over.
End of thread.

 

[MHB]

Well I could have said I had my pronouncing of wort corrected by a master brewer, whose opinion I hold in the highest possible regard.
Same thing without being a smart arse and I would need to have a pretty compelling reason to question that opinion.
Mark

 

[black_labb]

what if this master brewer had a lisp?

 

[Nick JD]

Wiktionary has the UK pronounciation as /wəːt/

Since we are not American, I will say it like this.

 

[drsmurto]

I always got pulled up in english! the teacher would pick out my words and say that letter is silent!, Well if its silent why the **** is it in there??? like knife nife, elephant elifant. I spelt the words out how they sounded its not my fault some stupid **** made letters silent lol or if you put a e at the end the whole word sounded different!

Your english teacher just did a facepalm. :icon_cheers:

 

[Bribie G]

I always got pulled up in english! the teacher would pick out my words and say that letter is silent!, Well if its silent why the **** is it in there??? like knife nife, elephant elifant. I spelt the words out how they sounded its not my fault some stupid **** made letters silent lol or if you put a e at the end the whole word sounded different!

Originally those letters were not silent, but English Orthography became "finalised" at a time that the language was still changing and was right in the end game of Anglo Saxon and Norman French amalgamating into Modern English. Which was bad timing. Also it didn't help that writers at the time ornamented their works with pompous and pretentious constructions in order to sound highly learned.

"Mayhap that ye Lorde Trevithick whilst enduring the lachrymaceous inveigling thrust Prometheus-like in Sybarytic ..... and I am going to go on for five pages without a full stop and place the verb at the end so listen good. "

And it was patchy even within the UK, For example even today you could still get away with "it's a braw bricht moonlicht nicht" in Scotland without being too severely glassed.

... OK then, what's this?

Fillet Minion?
Fee-lay Min-yon?

Guy walks into a high end patisserie on the way home from work. "How much are them gattocks in the window?"

Oh dear, Sir, they are not gattocks, they are gateaux. And they are $85

Wot, $85 for a cake? --- Bolleaux.



Edit: spelling :wacko:

 

[Gar]

How the ***** do we pronounce Zywiec Porter while we're at it

and is Saison pronounced Sci Son or Say Son (i've always said it Sci Son)

 

[stillscottish]

... OK then, what's this?

Fillet Minion?
Fee-lay Min-yon?

And what's the green stuff with it?

Broccolee or Broccoleye?

:unsure:

 

[drsmurto]

And what's the green stuff with it?

Broccolee or Broccoleye?

:unsure:

Gar-nish

 

[soundawake]

And here I was pronouncing it 'malt juice'

How silly of me

Soundawake (pronounced bob)

 

[Nick JD]

How the ***** do we pronounce Zywiec Porter while we're at it

and is Saison pronounced Sci Son or Say Son (i've always said it Sci Son)

rze-vyetz

say-zo

 

[MHB]

I have 3 Czech customers, they cant agree on how to say Saaz, well 2 of them cant the other one gives me the evil eye and says she is atec no Saaz... so go figure.
Mark

 

[Nick JD]

Saaz is a German word for Žatec like Bombay is an English word for Mumbai.

I would ask a German how to say Saaz if you want the right answer.

 

[super_simian]

I always got pulled up in english! the teacher would pick out my words and say that letter is silent!, Well if its silent why the **** is it in there??? like knife nife, elephant elifant. I spelt the words out how they sounded its not my fault some stupid **** made letters silent lol or if you put a e at the end the whole word sounded different!

It's in there as a way to separate the real humans from the walking Soylent Green!