Sweet beer, low mash temp!

[wereprawn]

I've mashed my first 2 AG beers at 64-62c for a drier brew. But, while delicious, they both have quite a bit of sweetness about them.

# 1

2.5 kg JW pils

800 g JW Wheat

800 g JW munich

250 g carahell

5 g magnum @ 60 min

15 g Saaz @ 60 min

30 g saaz @ 20 min

us-05 @ 16 c.

Og-? FG- 1010

Thought the carahell may have provided the sweetness so.....

90 min boil.

#2

4 kg JW trad ale

200 g JW Wheat

500 g JW Vienna

10 g Cascade @ 40 min

20 g Cascade @ 20 min

us-05

90 min boil.

Og-1043 Fg- 1008

I would not describe the beers as malty just a bit sweet. There is more body than expected too.

My thermometer has been calibrated against 2 others and they all read the same.

# 3 has more hops to counter the sweetness. But i was really aiming to get a dryish , light bodied ,lightly hopped quaffing beer.

Could add dex or sugar to reduce the body but i would like to get that aspect sorted with AG.

Any ideas would be much appreciated.

Cheers.

 

[mje1980]

Munich or the Vienna maybe?. Fermentation temp?

 

[Vini2ton]

Try some flaked rice and maybe a longer mash time. Done a couple with flaked and they seemed drier. Also, the longer in the bottle the more dry they become I reckon. Maybe forget about cara type grains if you want dry. Goodluck, dry is my quest also.

 

[beerbog]

US05 at 16 deg is pretty much on its lower end of the range. Maybe it stalled? Add some yeast nutrient during the boil to give it a bit of a kick and oxygenate/ thrash well. :beerbang:

 

[mje1980]

I'm surprised the low mash temp didn't dry it out. As mentioned above, do the same recipe and do a 90 min mash at those temps. That should dry it right out.

I find us05 can give a sweet/estery type flavour I don't like but 16 deg ferment should stop that definately.

 

[Beertard]

When and how much were the hop additions for #3?
Seems like very little bittering in #2

 

[wereprawn]

Thanks Vini and Gibbo . I keg so residual sweetness should not be a problem. The rice is going to be my next avenue. Don't know if it will help with the sweetness but may resolve the body issue. With all my beers i give them a couple of days at ambient in the fermenter to finish off. I have never had an FG lower than 1006 ( except for a couple of saisons ) with the kit/extract beers i used to make so i think 1010 - 1008 is probably about right. I will take your advice and get some nutrient with my next order though and see if that helps.

Thanks for the replies guys. If you have any more ideas i'm all ears.

Cheers.

 

[barls]

if you want dry. drop the crystal all together in there.

 

[wereprawn]

mje and steve. I will do the 90 min mash next time and see if that helps. #3 is an APA . Something with more hops to counteract the sweetness. So # 3 does not really matter here. Lightly hopped is exactly what i was after for those first 2 beers.

Cheers.

 

[wereprawn]

Yeah i did that barls.

 

[Bribie G]

The "yeast" books strays into mashing and one thing that caught my attention was Chris White debunking the Urban Myth that lower mashing temperature equals more dryness. Whilst higher mashing usually give more "body" there are many examples of beers that are mashed low but still have malt sweetness.

 

[Screwtop]

Cara/Crystal malt %'s are not over the top.

Beer is a sweet malt based beverage. Hops are used to reduce sweetness to balance the taste. Brewing is ALL ABOUT BALANCE!!

Bitterness levels in your recipes would be: #1 around BU:20 for a beer of around GU:48 and #2 around BU:10 for about GU:50

If you want a light refreshing light hopped beer, either make a lager of GU:47 from and BU:16 (Horizon Hops) using 22% Flaked Corn 11% Rice 67% Pils malt.

Or

Buy some XXXX Gold

Screwy

 

[Beertard]

You dropped the crystal
it's still too sweet
balance the sweetness with bitterness, it doesn't mean it has be any hoppier

 

[Vini2ton]

Taste.The final frontier.The Doors of Perceived malt sweetness.That's abuse telling someone to buy XXXX gold.

 

[wereprawn]

hmm ..that may be where i went wrong screwy I had the bitter/sweet thing down pat with my extract brews . But i just thought extract gave a sweeter finish than AG so adjusted my hops accordingly. All my hop additions were just educated guesses with long time extract/kit brewing. Seems i need reeducating.

xxxx gold ! Phfft. I may live more northerly than you but the hot tropical sun has not deteriorated my mind enough to enjoy it.

 

[wereprawn]

Taste.The final frontier.The Doors of Perceived malt sweetness.That's abuse telling someone to buy XXXX gold.

It's beer Vini , but not as we know it.

 

[manticle]

Might be vdk. Pure conjecture but would you describe the sweetness as anything like honey, butterscotch or buttered popcorn?
Higher mashed beers aren't necessarily super sweet - just mostly thicker bodied depending on other factors.

 

[wereprawn]

Might be vdk. Pure conjecture but would you describe the sweetness as anything like honey, butterscotch or buttered popcorn?
Higher mashed beers aren't necessarily super sweet - just mostly thicker bodied depending on other factors.

No nothing like those. vdk?

 

[manticle]

Group of chemicals known as vicinal diketones. Diacetyl is one of them, 2-3 pentanedione is another and has a honey like flavour.

 

[manticle]

Just glancing at the recipes and they look as if they may be underhopped. Reading on a phone so someone else may have already suggested. Alpha acid percentages and/or predicted ibu?