St Rogue Red Ale - Dry Hopped

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mika

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Bought a bottle from the IBS a couple of weeks back, only just got round to trying it the other night... OMFG ! Awesome !
So given the limited availability and not so limited price, I want to brew a clone. Which I've never really done before.

Did some google searching and came up with;

From Rogue;

Malts: Great Western Harrington, Klages, Munich & Hugh Baird Carastan 30-37 & 13-17, Crystal 70-80.

Hops: Chinook & Centennial.

Yeast & Water: Rogue's Pacman Yeast & Free Range Coastal Water.
Specs:

13 PLATO
44 IBU
73.1 AA
27 Lovibond

Supposedly from a BYO Clone recipe;

St. Rogue Red Ale Clone
5 Gallons, All Grain
OG: 1052
FG: 1015
IBU: 42
SRM: 26
ABV: 4.8%

7 lb. 2 row malt
1 lb. Munich
1 lb. Crystal 15
1.25 lb Crystal 40
1 lb. Crystal 75
10.5 AAU Chinook hops (90 min)
(0.95 oz of 11% alpha)
9.5 AAU Centennial hops (whirlpool or hopback)
(1 oz of 9.5% alpha)
Wyeast 1056 of WLP 001

Mash at 155 for 60 min. Ferment at 67
recipe assumes 65% efficiency

From someone who'd attempted it about 4 times;

This grain bill;

6.00 lbs. Shrier 2-Row
2.00 lbs. Durst Munich
1.25 lbs. DWC CaraMunich
.75 lbs. DWC CaraVienne
.50 lbs. Briess Crystal 80*L
.50 lbs. Briess Crystal 40*L

Matched with this hop bill;

1.10 oz. Chinook Whole(11.3 AA, 60 min.)
.30 oz. Centennial Pellets (8.8 AA, 60 min.)
.50 oz. Centennial Pellets (8.8 AA, 15 min.)
.50 oz. Centennial Pellets (8.8 AA, 5 min.)
.30 oz. Chinook Whole(11.3 AA, 5 min.)

Was looking more favourably at the last option, but was wondering if anyone else had already attempted to clone it, or had any other thoughts. I'm not real good at tasting and inventing a recipe, I couldn't even pick the hop :rolleyes:
 
yum yum yum yum yum one of my favs as well mr mika good luck with your crusade!
 
Apparently most American ale yeasts will come close, but the Pacman strain is preferred.
Ferment Am ale yeast at 20C, but use Pacman at 60F (16C). This is from BYO mag.
The recipe published in Zymurgy suggests plenty of Hugh Baird product and 2 hop additions.

Cheers
Les

Rogue6.jpg
 
What are the Hugh Baird products like and what's carastan all about ?
I've still got some Rogue beer here, so could probably re-culture the yeast from the bottle. Otherwise I'm a big fan of WY1272.
I'm mostly concerned about the large amount of crystal in this beer. It really didn't seem to come thru in the taste, to me at least.
 
I'll certainly provide feedback and a reference sample.
 
What are the Hugh Baird products like and what's carastan all about ?
I've still got some Rogue beer here, so could probably re-culture the yeast from the bottle. Otherwise I'm a big fan of WY1272.
I'm mostly concerned about the large amount of crystal in this beer. It really didn't seem to come thru in the taste, to me at least.
The red ale is a type of American amber, although usually more hoppy.
The Carastan is a light crystal made by (a Scottish mob of maltsters named) Bairds, according to their website, with some toffee flavour.
Red ales tend to use a variety of crystals and Munich to achieve a complex toffee/caramel/biscuit and toasty combination, on top of a light-flavoured malt base.

Hope this helps. I have been eyeing this recipe for a while and would really be happy to hear your results and final recipe. I have recently made an American amber, which is just starting to clear and taste true-to-type.

Beerz
Les
 
Hmm, might have to track down some more malts before I attempt this. I also haven't got any Centennial at the moment, so could be a while before I brew it. Just waiting for the weather to drop another couple of degrees so I can have fermenters out in the open, then I can really crank the brewing up.
 
Just tasted the Rogue Chipotle Ale on the weekend, extremley well balanced, smoked peppers sitting perfectly in the mix.
 
Props to RRob for help with the recipe, we've basically come to the conclusion that the yanks are mad using that much crystal, so have toned it down considerably and will work it from there. I'm only using 1272 as well, not any super pacman yeast, so will mash low for attenuation.
The IBU's are well over stated, but that's how I think my system comes out, always under on IBU's.
Might not come out as a great clone, but should be a nice beer regardless.

Rogue Red Ale - Clone attempt #1

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
----------------
Batch Size (L): 25.00 Wort Size (L): 25.00
Total Grain (kg): 7.10
Anticipated OG: 1.054 Plato: 13.23
Anticipated SRM: 12.7
Anticipated IBU: 53.8
Brewhouse Efficiency: 60 %
Wort Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Grain/Extract/Sugar
% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
67.6 4.80 kg. JWM Traditional Ale Malt Australia 1.038 3
18.3 1.30 kg. Weyermann Munich I Germany 1.038 8
4.9 0.35 kg. Weyermann Caramunich I Germany 1.036 51
7.0 0.50 kg. Weyermann Carared Germany 1.036 24
2.1 0.15 kg. Bairds Dark Crystal 80L England 1.034 80

Hops
Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
20.00 g. Hallertau Northern Brewer Pellet 7.60 16.7 60 min.
15.00 g. Magnum Whole 14.00 21.0 60 min.
5.00 g. Centennial Pellet 8.00 3.4 30 min.
5.00 g. Chinook Pellet 12.10 5.1 30 min.
5.00 g. Centennial Pellet 8.00 2.2 15 min.
5.00 g. Chinook Pellet 12.10 3.3 15 min.
5.00 g. Centennial Pellet 8.00 0.9 5 min.
5.00 g. Chinook Pellet 12.10 1.3 5 min.
20.00 g. Centennial Pellet 8.00 0.0 Dry Hop
20.00 g. Chinook Pellet 12.10 0.0 Dry Hop

Yeast
-----
WYeast 1272 American Ale II
 
Looks good Mika, i have been tempted todo a clone of this and their american amber ale sometime soon with some serious pondering on crystal malt %'s and the colour achieved from various combinations. i think i have recipes i devised saved for both of them in beersmith. i'll post when i get home. I dont think my additions where as blended as yours, more of a one for one at different time intervals for layering.

Be interesting to see your results!
 
The colour is an interesting one. The website claims 22Lov, but that's frickin dark and I honestly don't remember it being that dark. I was going to add some carafa special to bump it up, but then liked the look of it in Promash and I typically end a shade or two darker than what Promash tells me anyway. If I'm only out on the colour once it's kegged, I can live with that.
The hops are basically to the BYO recipe and others I've seen. Though the BYO recipe uses the C hops for bitterness, I wasn't quite that game, and ended up wussing out and using the hop regime from a Tasty recipe, which has the softer NB at the start. I would have used all Magnum, but it was all I had left. I also like to have 2/3rds or more of my bitterness at 60mins as I usually see a lot of hop fade and with such a large precentage of crystal I was worried about the aroma and late hops dissappearing and leaving me with a cloyingly sweet beer.
We'll see.
I've already started subbing, ran out of trad ale malt and rather than open a bag of Barret Burston, decided to finish off the TF GP I had kicking around.
 
The colour is an interesting one. The website claims 22Lov, but that's frickin dark and I honestly don't remember it being that dark. I was going to add some carafa special to bump it up, but then liked the look of it in Promash and I typically end a shade or two darker than what Promash tells me anyway. If I'm only out on the colour once it's kegged, I can live with that.
The hops are basically to the BYO recipe and others I've seen. Though the BYO recipe uses the C hops for bitterness, I wasn't quite that game, and ended up wussing out and using the hop regime from a Tasty recipe, which has the softer NB at the start. I would have used all Magnum, but it was all I had left. I also like to have 2/3rds or more of my bitterness at 60mins as I usually see a lot of hop fade and with such a large precentage of crystal I was worried about the aroma and late hops dissappearing and leaving me with a cloyingly sweet beer.
We'll see.
I've already started subbing, ran out of trad ale malt and rather than open a bag of Barret Burston, decided to finish off the TF GP I had kicking around.

Dont trust that colour, its some "malt colour units" calculation. its described in Designing Great Beers by Ray Daniels.

Its descriped in this NB forum thread as. http://forum.northernbrewer.com/viewtopic.php?t=40009

"I think for every malt in the batch you take the L of the malt, multiply it by how many lbs you are using, add them all up and divide by how many gallons the batch is"

So for yours its:

4.80 kg. JWM Traditional Ale Malt Australia 3 = 31.8
1.30 kg. Weyermann Munich I Germany 8 = 22.88
0.35 kg. Weyermann Caramunich I Germany 51 = 39.27
0.50 kg. Weyermann Carared Germany 24 = 26.4
0.15 kg. Bairds Dark Crystal 80L England 80 = 26.4

TOTAL is 146.75/6.604 gal = 22.22SRM compared to a expected SRM of 27 on the Rogue website. Maybe you do need more of the darker crystal.
 
Supposedly from a BYO Clone recipe;

St. Rogue Red Ale Clone
5 Gallons, All Grain
OG: 1052
FG: 1015
IBU: 42
SRM: 26
ABV: 4.8%

7 lb. 2 row malt
1 lb. Munich
1 lb. Crystal 15
1.25 lb Crystal 40
1 lb. Crystal 75
10.5 AAU Chinook hops (90 min)
(0.95 oz of 11% alpha)
9.5 AAU Centennial hops (whirlpool or hopback)
(1 oz of 9.5% alpha)
Wyeast 1056 of WLP 001

Mash at 155 for 60 min. Ferment at 67
recipe assumes 65% efficiency

From someone who'd attempted it about 4 times;

Matched with this hop bill;

1.10 oz. Chinook Whole(11.3 AA, 60 min.)
.30 oz. Centennial Pellets (8.8 AA, 60 min.)
.50 oz. Centennial Pellets (8.8 AA, 15 min.)
.50 oz. Centennial Pellets (8.8 AA, 5 min.)
.30 oz. Chinook Whole(11.3 AA, 5 min.)

Where are the 'dry hops' :eek:

Edit: I see you have fixed this with the latest incarnation of the recipe.
 
Think they do a regular version and a dry hopped version, it was the dry hopped version that I wanted.
Interesting on the colour. If I pull out the iPhone and use the Brewmath app, there's not a lot of difference between 22 and 27, it's all dark so we'll see how it goes.
About to transfer to the kettle, so that will be a good indication.
 
Hey Mika,

Latest recipe looks gold, I really think you have a solid recipe there. Re guarding the colour i've got a "Santa's Private Reserve" which is supposed to be the Dry Hopped Red ale with twice the hops i'll have to crack it open and do a colour comparison for ya, but perhaps their quoted 22 Srm is based on the recipe before the crazy pacman yeast strips some of the colour?

I punched your recipe into my software and pretty much got the same specs as you:

Mika's Ass Hat Red Rocket Ale

Original Gravity (OG): 1.054
Colour (SRM): 12.4
Bitterness (IBU): 56.2

67.6% Pale Ale Malt
18.3% Munich I
4.9% Caramunich I
7% Carared
2.1% Crystal 80

0.8 g/l Northern Brewer @ 60 Minutes
0.6 g/l Magnum @ 60 Minutes
0.2 g/l Centennial @ 30 Minutes
0.2 g/l Chinook @ 30 Minutes
0.2 g/l Centennial @ 15 Minutes
0.2 g/l Chinook @ 15 Minutes
0.2 g/l Centennial @ 5 Minutes
0.2 g/l Chinook @ 5 Minutes
0.8 g/l Centennial @ Dry Hop
0.8 g/l Chinook @ Dry Hop

Single step Infusion at 65*C for 60 Minutes. Boil for 60 Minutes

Fermented at 20*c with 1272

Recipe Generated with BrewMate
 
Yeah no way it's 22 srm by the time it makes it to us in the bottle, more like 14 srm by my eye balls.

I'm going to take a punt here and suggest that if you want the correct hue and not just a copper beer your going to need to add a smidge (technical term look t up on the dictionary) of roast barley to get you there!

Rob.
 
.....
Mika's Ass Hat ....
.....

Screw you ! :p

My batch size doesn't equal my fermenting size. I end up with 20L of wort, so the dry hopping is 2gm/L total, otherwise known as the Asher proportionality.


P.S. Maybe I am an ass hat. Just realised I've had my shirt on backwards all day :huh:
 
I loved this beer, tried it about 6 months ago, perfect for Winter IMO.... :icon_drool2:

:icon_cheers: CB
 
Screw you ! :p




P.S. Maybe I am an ass hat. Just realised I've had my shirt on backwards all day :huh:

Ha Ha classic, Quite funny to realiser your shirt is bac to front when you take it off and the tag is at the front or when you go to put something in your polo pcket and realise your shirts inside out and no-one has told you <_< .

Brad
 
Well all done, in the fermenter cooling down the last couple of degrees. Pitch a little bit later.
Colour wasn't that far off I reckon. Sample is from the end so a lot of hop matter in there as well.





 
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