Sour beers

[Tony]

I will take some pics of the fermenters....... nothing special but fun non the less.

I had a bit of a go at getting the white plastic plug out of the top of the demi but it wont budge. Im going to have to make a hook that goes in the airlock hole and pulls up from the bottom from some SS rod.

Im looking forward to see what those french oak chips have done over almost 1.5 years

 

[Jaded and Bitter]

nice.

reminds me I'm due to give the fanders red a sniff, not now though - its 5 degrees out there now.

 

[mje1980]

I got my plastic champagne stoppers and cages from brewcraft sa. Hard to find, but worth it I reckon, not as fancy as cork but so easy and reliable.

I have a 7 month old Flanders brown in a few glass carboys. I took the airlock off not long ago to add some pre funked oak chips and it smelt divine. Yum.

 

[Beerbuoy]

About to have my first crack at a sour. Having never tried a sour beer before I'm hesitant to spend up on a glass fermenter. I have some Wyeast Oud Bruin on the way and am planning on using Jamils recipe from brewing classic styles.

Couple of noob questions for the sour brewers out there.

I'm assuming with the wyeast Oud Bruin I still need to start out with a neutral yeast then add the bugs after a few days same as for Roselare or can the Oud Bruin be pitched as a primary ferment? Can't find any info on the wyeast site except that the oud bruin blend will leave the malt flavour intact unlike roselare.

In brewing classic styles JZ suggests fermenting for a month then transferring to a keg for ageing. Could I ferment for a month in plastic then transfer to the keg? This would save me having to buy a glass fermenter. Not worried about getting bugs in my plastic fermenter as its one I don't use anyway.

Cheers

 

[Kranky]

I don't know why anyone would use a neutral ale yeast with Roselare, if it's not broke don't fix it. Leaving the beer for a month in plastic and then transferring it to a keg to age is fine. Just make sure you have a sound seal on the keg when you keg it, you don't want a leak and oxygen getting in. I age a lot of beer in kegs and I put the gas on them every second month or so to make sure they haven't leaked, and to have a taste and see how they are going. Try not to move the keg as it will likely have a a pelical at the top. You can oak it with chips in the keg too but be careful how much you use, you don't want to overdo it.

When the beer is ready there will likely be some gunk at the bottom of the keg so when you move it, it kicks up and needs a bit of time to settle. You can either transfer the beer to another keg and kill the transfer when the line starts to look murky or just make sure you don't move the keg once it's in your fridge (usually not a problem but sometimes you move kegs around when you swap them over.)

 

[mje1980]

I didn't want to spend the cash on glass carboys, but considering the beer needs a minimum of 12 months in the fermentor, I didn't want to wait all that time and have a crazy sour beer. Too long in plastic let's oxygen in, and the beer can go south.

My first sour is 7 months old in the carboys now ( oud bruin ), and not long ago I added some oak chips. It smelt amazing. Hard to be patient, but you need to be with sour beers.

Good luck with it mate. At worst, rodenbach is pretty cheap to buy

 

[barls]

i call bullshit, ive got a sour in a plastic bucket and its over a year not too much vinegar in there

 

[mje1980]

Ah bugger then, didn't really need the glass . I leave my brett beers in plastic for a few months without worry, but read a lot about long term and plastic being bad.

They look pretty though .

 

[barls]

also the one i won club night with a few years ago was in one of those plastic water bottles for 7 months

 

[vykuza]

I do mine in corny kegs - not the cheapest, but I can control oxygen access, they get no light, and it's easy to rekeg/rack when they're done.

My big "solero" sour is in (legal) 50L keg, I remove half to bottle or keg, then top it up with fresh beer every 6 months or so.

 

[barls]

ill bring the one thats been in plastic to anhc you can try it.

 

[vykuza]

That would be awesome :icon_drool2:

 

[barls]

just about to keg it mate so it may happen. as always i taste about a week before and see if it needs longer.

 

[Boozed]

About to have my first crack at a sour. Having never tried a sour beer before I'm hesitant to spend up on a glass fermenter. I have some Wyeast Oud Bruin on the way and am planning on using Jamils recipe from brewing classic styles.

Couple of noob questions for the sour brewers out there.

I'm assuming with the wyeast Oud Bruin I still need to start out with a neutral yeast then add the bugs after a few days same as for Roselare or can the Oud Bruin be pitched as a primary ferment? Can't find any info on the wyeast site except that the oud bruin blend will leave the malt flavour intact unlike roselare.

In brewing classic styles JZ suggests fermenting for a month then transferring to a keg for ageing. Could I ferment for a month in plastic then transfer to the keg? This would save me having to buy a glass fermenter. Not worried about getting bugs in my plastic fermenter as its one I don't use anyway.

Cheers

Mate for what it's worth, my first sour was an ANZAC ale that I had designed years ago that didn't work out. It was too sweet, had way too much spec malt, too much of everything really. Barely drinkable, I toyed with the idea of dumping it but instead decanted it into a glass carboy any dropped a roselare pouch in.

9 months on the bugs then an additional 4 months on 2kg of raspberries and it became a bloody good drink. The bugs cut through the dextrines and dried it out nicely. the excess dextrines from the original brew gave the Brett something to munch on over time resulting in a very drinkable sour raspberry.

Obviously souring a beer that was designed to be sour is preferred but this is just a example of how, in this case, bugs made a shit beer drinkable!!

 

[manticle]

i call bullshit, ive got a sour in a plastic bucket and its over a year not too much vinegar in there

Like many things, it's peace of mind. I've aged sours in glass and plastic. Re-using bug blends like roeselare can see one or another bug dominate, given the right conditions. Certainly my third batch on the same yeast was as close to the acetic line as I personally enjoy - any more and it would be dressing rocket/ pear salad.
Glass reduces oxygen with no doubt whatsoever but whether plastic will increase aceto to unacceptable levels is entirely up to conditions, circumstances and palate. Glass is a safeguard - nothing more or less.

 

[Beerbuoy]

Thanks for the replies fellas.

I'll ferment in plastic for a month then rack to a corny.

I like the idea of being able to easily take samples from the corny as its my first sour I'll be keen to see how it changes over time.

 

[Jaded and Bitter]

Just had a quick look at wild brews, parently Oud Bruin is the "quickest" to make. Maybe try for ~2-3 months raised to the wyeast recomended 26-29 degrees and see hows it traveling. If you wanna leave longer consider racking to a HDPE bottle or glass.

From what I've read oud bruin is Lacto driven, which is a faster performer. though have done no oudsbruins myself.

 

[Danwood]

Just jumping in here...'scuse me...*shove shove*.....

How would Orval dregs go in a 5l carboy of WLP 007 RIS ?

I had a pint of Bacchus Shirraz RIS recently and it's inspired me. I have some french oak staves sitting in shirraz right now waiting for primary to finish.
Some 'sour' to kick the cherry/shirraz into high gear would be great, I think. I have almost 50l of RIS, so an experiment is called for.

The 007 should finish at 9-10% abv. Would the Orval strain be ok with this ?

Suggestions for other bottle dregs are welcomed. I have a couple of mead carboys empty, so two experiments would be interesting.

 

[vykuza]

It won't end up sour, but will end up funky and super dry. Left long enough, the Orval strain will go right through it!

 

[mje1980]

Orval dregs are great for funking up beers. You can swirl the dregs and add to individual bottles if you don't want to funk up a fermentor. Make sure it's finished fermenting and drink within a few months. I've done this a few times with great results