Sorry, yet another Wheat thread.

[Bomber Watson]

I tried to send Les the Weizenguy a pm but seems he cant take them right now.

So instead im starting a thread.

Im looking at doing a second home brew Wheat beer, my first one a couple of years ago being a total and utter failure and absolutely disgusting.

I've been drinking Burle Brewing Hef a bit recently, in the local mid-high 30's temp it has been a bit of a treat. Its currently around 28 degrees at nearly 10pm here so yeah, light bear time of year.

Now, they above mentioned "Heferweizen" is rather nice to me, not overly wheaty, but real strong bubblegum/banana flavour, and only just enough bitterness to balance it.

TMK its not actually a Heferweizen, as its filtered and pours clear, so that would make it a krystalweizen if im not mistaken? Stupid false advertising

Anyway, i would like to brew up something similar, and would like to run some ideas past you guys.

Basically what im thinking atm is 2x 1.5kg tins of Morgans Wheat extract, bittered with something....and fermented with Mangrove Jacks M20. Morgans and M20 being what the LHBS sells.

Re the bittering, From what i have gathered most wheats only have a single bittering addition at 60 minutes, does it really mater what hop you use for this? Im thinking most of the flavour/aroma would be gone by that time, so can i use what i have on hand (Galaxy, Cascade, Citra, Amarillo, Nelson Sauvin, Fuggles, Willamette, Pride of Ringwood, Falconers Flight, Prolly another copule I have forgotten about) for the addition, and just spice it to the correct IBU's, and be somewhat in the ballpark?

Also, will the M20 yeast give the desired strong banana flavour? Not sure if anyone has tried BB Hef or not to comment, but not quiet set up to go liquid yeasts yet.

Was thinking, and i tend to have some strange ideas, so bear with me, but had a thought that i could possibly get a bag of those banana lollies and dislolve them in some water and add it after primary has settled, or just chuck them in the boil to get a bit more banana flavour....Might be way off....

Also, would the two tins of Morgans Wheat be to wheaty for the style?

Also, i would probably ferment this along side a something (whatever i do next) on US05 so at around 18 degrees, would this be suitable or would the yeast react better to a slightly higher temp (20 or so?)

Have ze temp control.

Honestly i have no idea what im on about, as you can see i need help haha. 1

Cheers.

 

[peas_and_corn]

*Also, will the M20 yeast give the desired strong banana flavour?

According to this is will give off banana and vanilla flavours http://mangrovejacks.com/products/bavarian-wheat-10g-coming-soon However personally if you want the flavour profile you're looking for, the best yeast to go for is Wyeast weinstephaner yeast.

* i could possibly get a bag of those banana lollies...

Personally I wouldn't, mainly because they really don't taste that much like banana. There are threads around here about using actual bananas in beer.

* Also, would the two tins of Morgans Wheat be to wheaty for the style?

Nah. Most wheat beer kits are only 50% wheat malt anyway (including wheat malt extract) so you'll get to the percentage of wheat wheat beers use anyway. Wheat.

*would the yeast react better to a slightly higher temp (20 or so?)

If you want banana flavours yeah you need to ferment around 22-23C

 

[tazman1967]

I usually ferment German wheat beers at 18d,with the Wyeast weinstephaner yeast. It gives me a balance between clove/spices and the banana.
Ferment it at 22-24, you are going to get banana custard beer.. This yeast is also a top cropper and goes nuts, make sure you have plenty of head space in your fermenter.
As for hops, you should use German noble hops. eg. Hall, Tett or even Perle. Your hops listed would be great in an American Wheat.
A tin of Wheat and a tin of Pale should give you the right balance..
Best of luck with it..

 

[wombil]

I have made a nice hefewizen (40 litres) using;
5.1 kg pilsner
5.1 kg wheat malt
Halletaur mittlefreu hops.
I fermented 20 ltr with Wyeast 3333 German wheat and it was very nice.
The second 20 ltr used us-05 slurry and it seemed to bring out the flavours better than the wy 3333.
Now I really prefer the us-05 fermented one.

 

[Bomber Watson]

Righteo, movement has happened.

Dry hopped the IPA i have fermenting atm, will cold crash it friday night and bottle it next weekend, then its wheat time.

I picked up two tins of Morgans Wheat from the LHBS, and was going to grab some Mangrove Jacks M20 because im stubborn, cant buy liquid yeasts locally, and im stubborn, but they didnt have any so i grabbed some Safbrew WB-06.

Done a bit of reading and it seems this one is less bananary (is that a word?) and more bubblegummy, which could work ok. Planning on fermenting it at 23.

Also realized i have 80gm of German Halleratu or however you spell it in the hop vault that i cant remember why i brought so will use that.

Planning on just spritzing it up to say 15 IBU, will play around with the kit spreadsheet to work out how much to put in. Should i just do one 60 minute addition? One 40 minute addition? A 60 and a 20? The recepies i have read seem to vary a bit on the hop additions, probably depends on the style which im still not up with, to me at this point a wheat beer is a wheat beer....sorry.

Seeing though my temp controlled freezer holds two brews at once, i was wondering what to stick in with it, did a bit of looking around and a Saison seemed like the best bet.

Again, was going to grab a pack of Mangrove Jacks M27 Belgian Ale, but they didnt have any (had every other MJ yeast there...) so i grabbed a Safbrew T-58. This doesnt seem to be a proper Saison yeast, but sounds like it might work somewhat similar femented hot (23 degrees).

Also grabbed two tins of extra pale malt extract and 100gm of EKG, with every intention of copying this more or less:

http://blog.eckraus.com/blog/home-brewing-beer-2/saison-beer-recipe-all-grain-extract

Tossing up whether to give the T-58 a run in this or order some M27 online and run with that currently, still about a week away from laying these ones down.

Now, some more questions...

From what i gather i dont want to cold crash the Wheat beer? Most people seem to bottle them when there quiet cloudy, is this correct?

And how long should the wheat be left to clear? Im guessing it will ferment out pretty quick, so should it be bottled after say a week, or will two weeks in the fermenter be better/no worse?

Cheers.

 

[Dan Pratt]

I don't have all the answers but wb06 for a wheat beer, direct pitch it at 17c and ferment at that temp and you will get a nice clove aroma and some banana....if it's banana you want 23c will be overwhelming with that.

 

[Bomber Watson]

I see.

Its a bit interesting, i spent about two hours last night and tonight reading different threads on this forum and others about it, and it seems everyone who has used it has a different experience. Some say no Banana, some say lots, some say ferment it hot, some say cold...

Directly the fermentis website, and what i was working on mostly:

"fermentation temperature: 12-25°C (53.6-77°F) ideally 18-24°C (64.4-75.2°F)
for clover flavors : below 22°C (71.6°F)
for banana flavor: above 23°C (73.4°F)"

http://www.fermentis.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/SFBWB06.pdf

I"ll have a ponder, might end up dropping to say 21 or so and just seeing what damb well happens. Its not like US-05 where everyone has a similar oppinion about a good start point. Whatever i do the first time up is going to be an experiement/baseline anyway for me.

Thanks for your help though.

Cheers.

 

[Bomber Watson]

No one else has any answers to the specifics i asked about this brew?

Strange, hope i didnt piss anyone off.

Anyway,will be laying these down this weekend, need to work out a few specifics yet as no one has chined in wih advice, have a pack of danstar belle siason comong from full pint and will ise that instead of the t-58 for my first siason...

Cheers.

 

[paulyman]

No comment on the wheat beer, but I'm keen to see how it comes out as I'm planning a wheat beer with a nice banana/clove balance soon, so your experience will help me out.

As for the Belle Saison. I've done an extract with it at 22-24 and it is a cracker at only two weeks in the bottle. Will be slowly trying it over the next couple of months to see how it goes.

Have a second AG Belle in the fermentor at the moment I loved the first one so much, this one started at 20 but the weather should drag it up to 24-25 over the next couple of days.

*Edit - once the weather gets even hotter and into the 30's I'm going to try a Rye Saison with Wyeast 3724.

 

[Bomber Watson]

Cheers mate.

Will certainly report back.

 

[Bomber Watson]

Righto so ive had a few bevies and am done playing with Ians spreadsheet.

This is what i came up with for both brews....

"138 Weizen":

25gm Hallertauer for 40 minutes.

2x Morgans wheat tins.

WB06 yeast. 23 degree ferment. 2.8 vols carbonation on bottling.

20lt
OG 1.046
FG 1.014
IBU 11.9
EBC 5.6
% alc bottle 4.6

"179 Saison"

45gm EKG for 60 mins
20gm corriander seed 40 mins
25gm EKG for 20 mins
20gm corriander seed 20 mins

2x tins Morgans extra plale.
.6kg white sugar

Belle Saison yeast, 23 degrees ferment, 2.8 vols on bottling.

23lt
OG 1058
FG 1.012
IBU 27.5
EBC 5.3
% alc bottle 6.2

Both have a boil volume of 8 lt, hopefully the last brews i try to do with my shitouse pots on my shithouse stove, the 50lt boil kettle with 3600 watt element and temp controller is nearly ready to run, but wont be in time for these brews sadly.....

Cheers.

 

[Bomber Watson]

Well this is promising.

5 days in the fermenter and i decided to have a taster of the wheat.

Sg is 1.014 so nearly done according to ians spreadsheet.

Taste from the tube is fantastic. Not bitter, not sweet, slight wheat flavour bit not overpowering, and a slight banana/bubblegum flavour on the back of the tounge.

Lovely.

Didnt try the saison as its stil bubbling rapidly, went in a day after and its a bit harder to get to with how my freezer works.

See how it goes at bottling then at tasting.