session IPA recipe feedback

[mb-squared]

I've been reading up on how to brew a 'session IPA', which is ~4% ABV and loads of hop flavour. The problem with these recipes, it appears, is that they usually come across and thin and watery hop juice. The challenge, then, is to get enough body (whilst keeping it at ~4% ABV) to support the huge late hop additions. If anyone has puttered around with this style, I'd appreciate hearing your thoughts on the recipe below.

Cheers,

----------
Recipe: sessionIPA
Style: Session IPA (SIPA)
TYPE: All Grain
Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 63.82 l
Post Boil Volume: 55.12 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 50.00 l
Bottling Volume: 49.00 l
Estimated OG: 1.040 SG
Estimated Color: 6.9 EBC
Estimated IBU: 42.8 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 85.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 90.00 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
5.00 kg Gladfield Pilsner Malt (3.8 EBC) Grain 1 66.7 %
1.00 kg Gladfield Munich Malt (15.5 EBC) Grain 2 13.3 %
1.00 kg Gladfield Vienna Malt (6.8 EBC) Grain 3 13.3 %
0.50 kg Gladfield Wheat Malt (4.2 EBC) Grain 4 6.7 %

25.00 g Warrior [15.00 %] - First Wort 90.0 min Hop 5 24.5 IBUs

Flameout hop additions
25.00 g Citra [12.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 6 0.0 IBUs
25.00 g Equinox [14.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 7 0.0 IBUs
25.00 g Galaxy [14.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 8 0.0 IBUs
25.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 9 0.0 IBUs

Bring BK down to 85C and then add whirlpool additions; whirlpool for 15 min
25.00 g Citra [12.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15.0 Hop 10 4.1 IBUs
25.00 g Equinox [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15. Hop 11 4.8 IBUs
25.00 g Galaxy [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15.0 Hop 12 4.8 IBUs
25.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15.0 Hop 13 4.5 IBUs

1g/l Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) Yeast 14 -

25.00 g Citra [12.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 15 0.0 IBUs
25.00 g Equinox [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 16 0.0 IBUs
25.00 g Galaxy [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 17 0.0 IBUs
25.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 18 0.0 IBUs

Mash Schedule: Temperature Mash, 1 Step, Full Body
Total Grain Weight: 7.50 kg
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperature Step Time
Saccharification Add 19.56 l of water and heat 70.0 C 60 min
Mash Out Heat to 168.0 F over 10 min 76.0 C 10 min
Sparge: Fly sparge with 53.77 l water at 76.0 C

 

[mb-squared]

Well this didn't generate much feedback, but I think I've sorted it out. The first recipe, posted above, was OK, but not great. A little too thin in the body and a little too harsh in the bitterness for my liking, though others thought it was fine. I decided to opt for some "smoother" hops the second time around, and replace the Pilsner with Vienna as my base malt. Personally, I think this 2nd recipe has hit the jackpot. It has all the body of a full-strength IPA; it has all the flavor of a full-strength IPA; but the ABV is only 3.7%! It's a winner in my book and a definite repeat. In fact, I think I'll brew it again tomorrow

------------------
Recipe: session IPA #2
Style: Session IPA (SIPA)
TYPE: All Grain
Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 63.82 l
Post Boil Volume: 55.12 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 50.00 l
Bottling Volume: 49.00 l
OG: 1.042 SG
FG: 1.014 FG
Estimated IBU: 35.9 IBUs
Boil Time: 90 Minutes
Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
7.00 kg Gladfield Vienna Malt (6.8 EBC) Grain 1 93.3 %
0.50 kg Pale Crystal (100.0 EBC) Grain 2 6.7 %

10.00 g Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - First Wort 90.0 Hop 3 5.6 IBUs
10.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - First Wort 90.0 Hop 4 6.5 IBUs

50.00 g Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 5 8.6 IBUs
50.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 6 10.1 IBUs

whirlpool addition #1
50.00 g Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool Hop 7 2.4 IBUs
50.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool Hop 8 2.8 IBUs

whirlpool addition #2
150.00 g Citra [12.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool Hop 9 0.0 IBUs

4.0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) Yeast 10 -

Mash Schedule: Temperature Mash, 1 Step, Full Body
Total Grain Weight: 7.50 kg
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperature Step Time
Saccharification Add 25 l of water and heat 70.0 C 60 min
Sparge: Fly sparge with 40 l water at 76 C
Notes:
------
whirlpool addition #1 done at flameout. turn chiller on immediately and drop to 65C asap.
whirlpool addition #2 done when BK temp reaches 65C. hold BK at 65C and whirlpool for 25 minutes, then drop temp to pitching temp
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[Adr_0]

Bugger, sorry I didn't see the first one.

That looks great. My gripe with the session IPA is exactly as you have said. Glad to see the Vienna and high mash temp has done the trick.

 

[mb-squared]

yep, the Vienna made a big difference, but I think the change in hops and using a lower temp for the second whirlpool addition were important changes too.

 

[droid]

Cool.

It's times like this I ask myself;

A) Was it the grain change?
B) The hop change?
C) The change in hop timings?
D) All of the above?

 

[droid]

The cool face for B was unintentional but I can't change it..

 

[mb-squared]

I'm sure it was all of the above. This wasn't about making small incremental changes to a recipe; this was about finding a recipe to start with. I think I have that now and so any future brews with this recipe will be small and more controlled. But to be honest, as of right now, I don't think I'll need to make any changes to this one.

 

[Dan Pratt]

Well this didn't generate much feedback, but I think I've sorted it out. The first recipe, posted above, was OK, but not great. A little too thin in the body and a little too harsh in the bitterness for my liking, though others thought it was fine. I decided to opt for some "smoother" hops the second time around, and replace the Pilsner with Vienna as my base malt. Personally, I think this 2nd recipe has hit the jackpot. It has all the body of a full-strength IPA; it has all the flavor of a full-strength IPA; but the ABV is only 3.7%! It's a winner in my book and a definite repeat. In fact, I think I'll brew it again tomorrow

------------------
Recipe: session IPA #2
Style: Session IPA (SIPA)
TYPE: All Grain
Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 63.82 l
Post Boil Volume: 55.12 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 50.00 l
Bottling Volume: 49.00 l
OG: 1.042 SG
FG: 1.014 FG
Estimated IBU: 35.9 IBUs
Boil Time: 90 Minutes
Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
7.00 kg Gladfield Vienna Malt (6.8 EBC) Grain 1 93.3 %
0.50 kg Pale Crystal (100.0 EBC) Grain 2 6.7 %

10.00 g Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - First Wort 90.0 Hop 3 5.6 IBUs
10.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - First Wort 90.0 Hop 4 6.5 IBUs

50.00 g Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 5 8.6 IBUs
50.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 6 10.1 IBUs

whirlpool addition #1
50.00 g Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool Hop 7 2.4 IBUs
50.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool Hop 8 2.8 IBUs

whirlpool addition #2
150.00 g Citra [12.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool Hop 9 0.0 IBUs
4.0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) Yeast 10 -

Mash Schedule: Temperature Mash, 1 Step, Full Body
Total Grain Weight: 7.50 kg
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperature Step Time
Saccharification Add 25 l of water and heat 70.0 C 60 min
Sparge: Fly sparge with 40 l water at 76 C
Notes:
------
whirlpool addition #1 done at flameout. turn chiller on immediately and drop to 65C asap.
whirlpool addition #2 done when BK temp reaches 65C. hold BK at 65C and whirlpool for 25 minutes, then drop temp to pitching temp
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Very similars to Kals Electric Session Ale recipe apart from the malt bill, I have a session ale in planning but using Rakua Hops.

http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=27506

Do you think you need some carapils to add some body?

 

[Droopy Brew]

IMO your bitterness in the first version wasn't to do with the type of hops but rather a mis- calculation. Your flame out additions accounted for 0 IBUs while your whirlpool accounted for 17 IBUs. So you probably ended up with a 60+IBU beer because those flameout hops would have easily added 20IBUs.

 

[mb-squared]

Very similars to Kals Electric Session Ale recipe apart from the malt bill, I have a session ale in planning but using Rakua Hops.

http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=27506

Do you think you need some carapils to add some body?

wow, those are similar. I didn't know about this recipe but I have brewed his 'electric pale ale' before and I really like the Centennial/Amarillo combo followed by a Citra bomb at the end. I've started adding my Citra into the whirlpool once the BK gets down to around 65C and have been skipping the dryhop altogether. Personally I think the grain bill with ~95% Vienna yields enough body as it is. I've never used Carapils before, but adding some would give it even more body presumably -- which might let you up the hops a tick.

 

[mb-squared]

IMO your bitterness in the first version wasn't to do with the type of hops but rather a mis- calculation. Your flame out additions accounted for 0 IBUs while your whirlpool accounted for 17 IBUs. So you probably ended up with a 60+IBU beer because those flameout hops would have easily added 20IBUs.

well, the first recipe has 200g of post-boil additions and the second recipe has 250g of post-boil additions. but I think there probably were more IBUs in the first recipe because all of the post-boil hops were added at 85+ degrees. In the second recipe, I made sure that the BK was down to 65C before adding the second whirlpool addition.

I don't pay much attention to Beersmith's IBU calcs for post-boil additions. For example, Beersmith adds IBUs for whirlpool additions but not for flameout additions in a recipe that is followed by a whirlpool.

 

[Reman]

For English Dark Milds, the usual trick is to up the crystal to 20%+. First to second went from 0% to 7% crystal, try going higher might get you even more body and mouthfeel. My 3.5% dark mild has 20% crystal and it still retains a decent amount of body after mashing at 69c.

The other one I heard/drank recently was to use rye malt. Drank a 2% ABV beer with 50% rye malt and it had the body of closer to a 4.5%. It was superb.

 

[Dan Pratt]

I don't pay much attention to Beersmith's IBU calcs for post-boil additions. For example, Beersmith adds IBUs for whirlpool additions but not for flameout additions in a recipe that is followed by a whirlpool.

End of boil additions on beersmith should be the steeping/whirlpool option so you can choose a time/length. Entering boil as Zero will be zero ibu.