RecipeDB - Nelson Sauvin Summer Ale

[Nicko_Cairns]

Oh forgot.. Not clear but yummy!

 

[Nicko_Cairns]

I made it with NS, the hop bitterness is there, maybe a bit bitey for my virgin AG palate, but it still drags me back for more and more...I'm not sure if it's too much of a bitey hops forward taste or not compared to the original (haven't tasted the original yet), but I'd definitely add the bitterness additions a bit later next time to make it slightly more quaffable IMO. I like the idea Katie, I'm going to try this one with galaxy and then citra as it's a really nice brew and as I think Ross pointed out, a good brew for trying different hops.

This beer has probably been in the keg now for six weeks at a guess, I finished a partially full keg a while ago but this second keg has really just shifted into fifth gear, or awesome mode.. The bitterness is balanced and smooth and this brew is a real winner. I will absolutely brew this again and as Ross suggested I will try different hops as I go. The next time I brew this I will try to ignore the keg for a month before drinking.

 

[Ciderman]

What's the latest hop schedule on this beer? I see the mash addition has been removed?

 

[hobospy]

First attempt at BIAB and I'm planning to use this recipe, bit late to change my mind as I've put in my grain order :-D Just wondering if there is a change to the recipe specified as there seems to be a number of posts stating mash out temperatures of 72/76/78C but this doesn't seem to be mentioned in the recipe itself. Is it OK to mash fully at the specified temp for 60 minutes or does there need to be a step up and if so which temperature should I be aiming for?

Thanks,

Christopher

 

[Kumamoto_Ken]

Hi hobospy,

You'd almost certainly be fine with a 60 minute mash but you'd get better efficiency with a mashout. There's a good post on the reasoning somewhere in the monster BIAB thread, by thistyboy. My basic understanding is the enzyme activity will increase as you ramp the temp up, until you start denaturing (killing) them.

The Summer Ale recipe calls for a 64C mash, which is relatively low so many would increase the mash length to 90 minutes regardless.

I made the leap to BIAB about this time last year (20 brews done now) and typically will mash for 90 minutes and then mashout at 78C. It takes about 20-22 minutes to ramp up to 78C on my system, 40L Crown urn with a concealed element.
It works for me. You have to heat your liquor to a boil anyway, so if you can gain some efficiency by agitating your mash while ramping up to mashout then why not? If you are going to do it just beware when adding your heat that you don't scorch your bag.

I've recently brewed this grain bill for a couple of single hop beers, using Riwaka and Mosaic. As Ross says it's a really good grain bill for getting a feel for what a hop variety brings to the table. It's also a pretty simple bill which would be perfect for your first crack at BIAB...good luck!

Plenty of others on here with more expertise and experience to add than me, but that's my 2c.

Cheers,

Ken

 

[Ciderman]

I'm not BIAB but I found the 64 degree temp was too low. I may have lost a degree in the mash but it fermented all the way out to 1006.

 

[hobospy]

Thanks for that Ken. I'm actually going to be using a 40l Crown with a concealed element so that is a good reference point. Think I will do as suggested and move the mash time out to 90 minutes, should the ramp up time be included in this 90 minutes or should it start after you have had the mash at 64C for 90mins?

And pardon my ignorance, just ordered my first brewing reference type book, but what does it mean when it ferments to lower numbers? Is it just a drier/not so sweet beer?

 

[Kumamoto_Ken]

I start the ramp after the ninety minutes. For me it then takes about another 20-22 minutes to get up to 78 while agitating the whole time and then I turn the power off, get my pulley ready, tie off the bag and hoist. I don't rest it for 10 minutes or anything at that temp. I found the post I mentioned earlier and have copied it below. TB says there's no point in a rest once you're up to 76-78 and his logic (and experience) is good enough for me.

The lower final gravity tends to mean a drier beer with less body. Which may be what you're after depending on the style you're going for.
My two efforts at this grain bill have both finished up at 1010.

Good luck, and let us know how you go.

Cheers,

Ken


Thirsty Boy, on 04 Apr 2012 - 12:22 PM, said:

practicalfool, on 03 Apr 2012 - 7:51 PM, said:

The purpose of the mashout is to a) Denature the enzymes and lock in the sugar profile & B) make the mash runnier.

point a) would make me think that the 10 minutes is to ensure all the enzymes are killed & to ensure all of it has reached that temp so there aren't any dense colder spots left over.

no its not - not in BIAB anyway.

mashout in BIAB is about 2 things. Efficiency and starch conversion.

Starch Conversion - BIAB is not the ideal mash environment - people can bleat and moan all they like, but it isn't. BIAB also misses the vorlauff step that a normal mash/lauter tun has and finally BIAB radically disturbs the mash bed during the lauter process.

All of which means, that there is a reasonable chance of there being some unconverted starch and that any unconverted starch in the mash (and if you mention an idodine test at this point, you dont actually know how they work) is far more likely to end up in the boil kettle with a BIAB brew than it would be with a mash/lauter tun brew.

So - you intensify your mash and make sure you convert all your starch. The way you do it, is by increasing the temperature of the mash beyond the gelatinisation point of even the really resistant starches, by stirring to access the physically trapped and isolated starches and by doing this gradually over a period of time to give the remaining enzymes (which will be working overtime in the increased temperature environment) time to convert the starches as they are gelatinised.

Take 10 minutes or so to constantly stir your mash as you raise it to a temperature of 76-78� and something along the lines of all your starches will be liberated, just in time for the last gasp of the dying enzymes to convert them to sugars.

This doesn't require any rest period at the "mashout" temperature - there is no point to a rest. There is a point to constant stirring and a gradual raise in temperature. So any mashout you might do that doesn't involve both these things is more or less pointless and I would just skip it.

Efficiency - well, your mash is more intensive, you convert more starch to more sugar, and your lauter is at a "normal" lauter temperature.... it all works just a little better than if you dont do it and I would expect a bump in efficiency (measured in the kettle) of say 3-5% by doing a mash out vs just. pulling the bag at the end of a 60 min mash. Less return for effort if you normally mash for 90min, but still a little.

Do you "need" to do it?? Hell no! But its something that I think constitutes good brewing practise and will make it more likely that you will end up with fault free beer that resembles the beer you were trying to make.

60 min mash
Raise gradually with constant stirring to 76-78�
Pull Bag

Adds maybe 5 mins to your brew day and in return you get a modest efficiency bump and a tick in a box for consistent quality brewing practise.

TB

 

[hobospy]

Thanks for that, will let you know how I go, probably won't get a chance to get this done till next weekend as I have two brews in my fridge at the moment but will post back on how it all went / results

 

[Nicko_Cairns]

Hi guys, I'm thinking about brewing this again but raising the IBUs to about 65 and turning it into an IPA, any dramas doing that with this recipe? (As I'm fairly new to AG).

Thanks!

 

[sponge]

No problems, you'll just need to balance it out by increasing the grist and OG.

 

[Nicko_Cairns]

Thanks mate.

 

[udev02]

Made this brew over the weekend. I've done it in kit format before and really liked it. This time the full grain version. Target final volume was 40 liters, got 43 liters. Too much water in the batch sparge. Original gravity of 1048, bit below my target of 1052. Can't wait to try it.

 

[PurpleHaze]

Just about to give the Nelson Sauvin Summer Ale a go...

INGREDIENTS
Lager Malt 1.7kg
Pale Malt Blend
Crushed crystal grain
Nelson Sauvin Hops
American Ale Yeast

That is the kit that I have bought.
I've also managed to get my hands on some pure Water with no additives.

Just wondering if anyone recommends anything to add to this?

 

[Milk-lizard84]

I'm currently enjoying a batch of this at the moment. Didn't think it would taste so nice as I dumped my cube into an unsanitized fermenter. Was cursing black and blue but prayed for a christmad miracle and it turns out Jebus did save me or the brew gods.
It's a really simple recipe with great results. Thanks to who ever created the recipe.

 

[Milk-lizard84]

Doing some gardening today which I hate but nothing softens it when enjoying a brew that turned out great. Love this recipe and will definitely brew again.