Pseudo Lagers

[sluggerdog]

Hi All,

I am looking for some suggestions from those who are in the know when it comes to making pseudo lagers and/or pilsners.

I am in the process of making a range of pilsners/lagers using different variations of hops and grains to try and find my perfect pils/lager so I can have a stock standard brew. Once I have picked my recipe I will start with the lager yeasts again.

Anyway I want to make it using an ale yeast, basically so I can test it out a lot quicker. (from grain to keg in a few weeks)

I have just done a few, 1 using safale S33 and the second using S04. I was pretty happy with the results of both. they both cleared VERY well and I was able to keg them within 8 days. (5 primary, 3 secondary)

Before I keep on going I thought I would ask the question, is there a liquid yeast out there that might be better to use then the safales?

I can only brew at about 25C so I am limited by this a little.

I was thinking the Klsch yeast however as it is low Flocculation it is kind of out of what I wanted.

I had also thought maybe the California Lager Yeast but then again it is only up to 20C.

Then my last thought was to continue using the safales but using Amylo 300 to dry the beer up.

Would love to see what comments or suggestions you have for me.

Thanks
SD :beer:

 

[ozbrewer]

Hi All,



Anyway I want to make it using an ale yeast, basically so I can test it out a lot quicker. (from grain to keg in a few weeks)

[post="61273"][/post]​

you wont get the profile of a lager using Ale yeast, it just dont work that way.

if you want to make a lager you like, pick a pale malt you like, and a hop that you like, makle it as bitter as you like. but it has to be fermented slowly, and it needs to lager....otherwise make coopers kit lager

 

[Kai]

I would say choose any ale yeast that has low ester formation and ferment as cold as possible, but someone else might be able to be more specific than that. Check out the list at http://wyeastlab.com/beprlist.htm and see if you like the sound of any of the ale yeasts there

 

[sluggerdog]

1335 British Ale Yeast II. Typical of British and Canadian ale fermentation profile with good flocculating and malty flavor characteristics, crisp finish, clean, fairly dry. Flocculation - high; apparent attenuation 73-76%. (63-75 F, 17-24 C)

Above doesn't sound too bad, any experiance?

 

[Kai]

If it's typical of a british ale fermentation profile then i don't know if it would fit the bill.

 

[sluggerdog]

Thanks Kai, I might just stick with the safale then.

It's not so much about being a lager that I like, it is the ingredients. pilsner malt with saaz and halleratu hops...

 

[Aaron]

I have not used it before but from the descriptions I would give Wyeast 1010 American Wheat a go.

 

[TidalPete]

Thanks Kai, I might just stick with the safale then.

Sluggerdog,
You are in Brissie & I am up the Coast, &, to the best of my knowledge we are both limited to partials at the moment. I do not know if you have temp control (regulated fridge or other) but I do not. Without any temp control in our geographical situation any lager at any time of the year is bound to turn out a '*******' lager no matter what yeast is used. Coopers are well known for their rep to ferment a good brew in climates like ours & I have had no problems with banana tastes, etc with a coopers culture. If you can improve on my situation please let me know.

 

[vlbaby]

I'm surprised you can produce a lager type beer with safale. Everytime I've used it i've found it produces heaps of esters. I've found that the coopers dry yeast produces a cleaner result.

vlbaby.

 

[sluggerdog]

I've got the old fridge but hate waiting 8 weeks to see if a brew is good or not. Wanting to use the ale yeast for testing purposes.

 

[kungy]

It kind of sounds like you are trying to do a cream ale (but perhaps with a little more body and bitterness than a standard cream ale), a style common enough in the US but not done too often from the sounds in Australia. The common yeast tends to be American Ale yeast. Here is a recipe that i have got from Beertools, Annes Cream Ale, you could sub saaz for the cascade to simplify. I plan to do this in a couple of months.

20L Batch @ 75% for 1.045 SG

2.75 kg Pale Malt
0.90 kg Wheat Malt
0.35 Flaked Rice

15g Czech Saaz Pellets @ 5% for 60 min
7g Cascade Pellets @5.5% for 30 min
7g Saaz Pellets @ 5% for 30 min

Mash grains at 150 degrees for 60 minutes, sparge with 160 degree water. Bring to boil and add hops per schedule. At end of 60 minute boil cool wort quickly, when it reaches 80 degrees pitch yeast. Primary ferment between 68 - 73 degrees for one week, then rack to secondary and add dry hops. Keep in secondary for 2 weeks, then prime with 3/4 cup corn sugar and bottle. Condition in bottle for at least a week.

Will

 

[sluggerdog]

Very similar kungy, thanks. Might give the american ale yeast a go.

 

[Stuster]

slugga

i haven't used it but what about the white labs east coast ale. specs below

stuart

East Coast Ale (WLP008) yeast strain
Our "Brewer Patriot" strain can be used to reproduce many of the American versions of classic beer styles. Similar neutral character of WLP001, but less attenuation, less accentuation of hop bitterness, increased flocculation, and a little tartness. Very
Attenuation: 70-75; Flocculation: low to medium; Optimum Ferm. Temp: 68-73

 

[AndrewQLD]

Try Whitelabs WLP007 DRY ENGLISH ALE, a great liquid yeast, attenuates VERY well and Floccs out quickly. If brewed at 16-18c it is very clean and malty with very little fruit esters. a great yeast for making pseudo lagers.

Andrew

 

[TidalPete]

Try Whitelabs WLP007 DRY ENGLISH ALE, a great liquid yeast, attenuates VERY well and Floccs out quickly. If brewed at 16-18c it is very clean and malty with very little fruit esters. a great yeast for making pseudo lagers.

Andrew

[post="61357"][/post]​

Sounds like a good one for our Qld winters down on the flats Andrew. Especially for those without any temp control. I'll give it a go.

 

[Jovial_Monk]

So is Nottingham, can work down to 14C, not much fruity esters created

JM

 

[KoNG]

Slugger,
if you've got the fridge, the S-04 you have works down at 15degC that should abate most of the ale flavours.

 

[sluggerdog]

Thanks Kong, I have the fridge but do not have the thermostat so it only ranges between 0 and 12C.

Think I need to get a thermostat on it ASAP.

Any suggestions for somewhere in brisbane where I can get one?

 

[johnno]

1335 British Ale Yeast II. Typical of British and Canadian ale fermentation profile with good flocculating and malty flavor characteristics, crisp finish, clean, fairly dry. Flocculation - high; apparent attenuation 73-76%. (63-75 F, 17-24 C)

Above doesn't sound too bad, any experiance?

[post="61283"][/post]​

Try Whitelabs WLP007 DRY ENGLISH ALE, a great liquid yeast, attenuates VERY well and Floccs out quickly. If brewed at 16-18c it is very clean and malty with very little fruit esters. a great yeast for making pseudo lagers.

Andrew

[post="61357"][/post]​

I used the 1335 in about 5 brews over the last 8 months and am currently using the 007. I have only made ales with them at temps of about 20-22C.
I dont know how they would go for a lager but they are both very dry.
To my jaded palette I would even go as far as saying they may be the same or very similar yeast.

cheers
johnno

 

[johnno]

And i should add that even at those temps there was very few fruit esters.

johnno