No Chill In A Fermenter

[Vanoontour]

Is it possible to no chill in a fermenter? Pour the hot wort into the FV and wrap glad wrap over the lid? I have sterilised the FV and was wondering if this could work? Once cooled give it a good stir with a sterile spoon and pitch yeast?

Thoughts?

Dan

 

[kelbygreen]

I have done that and I have just left it in the pot and put glad wrap over that then put the lid on. Although I prob wouldnt do it if using a ball valve or if you did clean and sanitise the outlet well before draining.

 

[manticle]

It's possibly going to work 8 times out of ten.

To my mind, no chill is great because it works every time by eliminating certain risks. Squeezing the air out helps with that. The only time I have had infections in no-chill cubes is when they haven't sealed properly.

Give it a go - will probably work but be prepared if it doesn't and don't blame the concept of no chill for any failures.

For a cost of about $20 or less (to buy a cube), I'm not sure why anyone would need to 'experiment' with a very simple method that works well as it stands but it's not my beer.

People no chill/slow chill in their brew kettle with success.

 

[hirns]

With no chill the idea is to purge as much air as possible, put the lid on the cube and the invert it so that the heat santisizes everything in contact with the brew. When the brew cools it forms a vacuum. If I had a lid for the fermenter without the airlock hole I might try it, but I'd still be worried about head space air without a blanket of Co2 and no vacuum.

Manticle Beat me.

Hirns

 

[Vanoontour]

Might have needed to be clearer and perhaps no chill might not be the correct term. I only want somewhere out of the way to cool it before pitching the yeast. Not store for any length.

 

[tavas]

Depends how long you leave it before pitching. You'll only get maybe 1 day with gladwrap on before she'll start self fermenting. I know from experience.

Get a cube. You only need one infected brew to pay for it. Plus you run the risk of infecting your fermenter.

 

[Tim F]

I do it every single brew, I can't see any more risks with this method than pouring from cube into a fermenter, as long as you pitch as soon as it gets down to temp? I do whack it in the fermenting fridge to get down faster though.

 

[manticle]

Might have needed to be clearer and perhaps no chill might not be the correct term. I only want somewhere out of the way to cool it before pitching the yeast. Not store for any length.

Most of my no-chill brews are pitched the next morning. The ones that aren't are pitched within three days. Same principle applies.

No chill or slow chill are the correct terms and the risks are the same if you do it outside the tried and true method. You won't die though so either go ahead and try or buy a cube,

 

[manticle]

I do it every single brew, I can't see any more risks with this method than pouring from cube into a fermenter, as long as you pitch as soon as it gets down to temp? I do whack it in the fermenting fridge to get down faster though.

I'd say there's a fair bit more risk leaving a brew for several hours/overnight at pathogen friendly temps when not properly sealed compared with pouring it from one vessel to another over a period of about 1 minute.

I've eliminated that risk by fermenting straight in my NC cubes. If it works for you then great but being aware of the risks is still valuable, even if you accept or welcome them (or decide they are overstated).

 

[jbowers]

I do it every single brew, I can't see any more risks with this method than pouring from cube into a fermenter, as long as you pitch as soon as it gets down to temp? I do whack it in the fermenting fridge to get down faster though.

There are more risks because you are potentially exposing it to truckloads of airborne bacteria. Through no chilling with minuscule amount of headspace, and through covering every surface of the container with near boiling wort for a significant amount of time, you minimise these risks exponentially. The other thing is, by pouring it once chilled, after carefully siphoning trying to reduce splashing whilst hot, you increase aeration whilst reducing the risk of hot side aeration.

To be honest, I'd give your method a crack if I didn't love the idea of cube hopping so god damned much. There is something deeply exciting about trapping hop flavours/aromas inside an airtight cube with nowhere to go but inside my beer.

Beaten by Manticle. Dammit man, you are just too quick.

 

[jbowers]

I'd say there's a fair bit more risk leaving a brew for several hours/overnight at pathogen friendly temps when not properly sealed compared with pouring it from one vessel to another over a period of about 1 minute.

I've eliminated that risk by fermenting straight in my NC cubes. If it works for you then great but being aware of the risks is still valuable, even if you accept or welcome them (or decide they are overstated).

Manticle, how do you achieve enough headspace during fermentation using the cube as a fermenter?

 

[manticle]

Firstly, if I was using 3787 or 3068 or 1762 or similar krausen monsters in super big beer, I would probably transfer. However in my experience I have found that even with a litre of headspace, the willow jerry cans will only ever leak a weeny bit of krausen with the lids backed off a few turns. I clean the cube and spray with starsan to deter vinegar flies and so on, but it really isn't an issue, beyond a small amount of leaking yeast for maybe 2 or 3 days. I've even filled cubes to the brim with an active starter with similar results.

Maybe it's the shape of the cubes?

I have done similar in FWK cubes with similar results.

These are generally beers between 1050 -1070 OG with yeasts ranging from UK (1099, 1026, 1098, 1968, 1768) to US (1272, US05,).

 

[wombil]

I have no chilled in the fermenter with no problems.
I also have a spare fire extinguisher and give the fermenter a good shot of CO2 first to displace air and as the fermenter fills up it is under the blanket of CO2.No worries.
My theory anyway,seems to work.
Last lot I strained through 40 micron filter paper hot.Just have to see how it turns out.

 

[Mayor of Mildura]

Manticle you must be the unluckiest dude ever. I feel for you and your infected beer issues. I certainly wouldn't want them. I no chill into a cube and have had no issues. I have also in the past no chilled in the fermenter as the op suggested and have had no issues. This is defiantly something that you have to try for yourself to see if it will be an issue or not. I reckon if you clean and sanitize well you'll at least give yourself a fighting chance.

 

[bradsbrew]

I've had one sitting in a fermenter with glad wrap on it since last saturday, its waiting to go into the fermeezer. I have on plenty occasions filled the first 2 cubes and run the last one into a fermenter with glad wrap on it but I pitch the next day, so within 24hrs. This time due to time and laziness I hav't kegged the 2 brews in the fermeezer and the other 4 cubes were full.

But really you can do it no problems if you are going to pitch the next day.


Cheers Brad

 

[Flash_DG]

I do it every single brew, I can't see any more risks with this method than pouring from cube into a fermenter, as long as you pitch as soon as it gets down to temp? I do whack it in the fermenting fridge to get down faster though.

Same, have no chilled in a blue willow fermenter for the last 2 yrs, the one time i decided to get and use a cube i got an infection. This blue fermenter doesn't have a hole in the lid so I can seal it up good and tight. Can be a real pita to open it up when ready to pitch lol

edit for speeling

 

[Tim F]

I'd say there's a fair bit more risk leaving a brew for several hours/overnight at pathogen friendly temps when not properly sealed compared with pouring it from one vessel to another over a period of about 1 minute.

I've eliminated that risk by fermenting straight in my NC cubes. If it works for you then great but being aware of the risks is still valuable, even if you accept or welcome them (or decide they are overstated).

I reckon the boiling wort and steam is going to kill anything in the fermenter anyway, I wouldn't leave it there for ages but it seems like minimal risk to do it overnight. To be fair I do sometimes use a 30l cube as a fermenter and screw the lid up while it cools, but I don't squeeze the air out. The last couple of brews though I have used normal fermenters and don't seem to have problems so far. Got nothing against cubing of course and I'm pretty interested in having a shot at cube hopping soon but this has been working pretty well for me the last few years - lets me be pretty lazy and still get a good result

 

[manticle]

@MoM: I find the blue willow jerries to be much less bulky anyway so no chilling and fermenting in them suits me well. I use my two barrel type fermenters for a bottling bucket and any beer or beverage that's higher volume than the cube allows.

I have no doubt that no chill in the fermenter works well for many but it's not something that would give me any advantage to try since I already have more jerries than fermenters and I can comfortably fit far more jerries in my fermenting space than I can barrels. It also seems like adding one extra risk factor without any major gain since cubes are easy to use and cheap.

The infection that has occurred here in the past is usually the same one and probably relates to a plant on the property. I never want to see it again.

 

[pcmfisher]

@manticle, After fermenting in a no chill cube, how do you get the beer out? Syphon? or do you have a tap in the bottom?

 

[felten]

osmosis



can't speak for mants, but I drill out the threaded hole on my jerries for use with NC/FVs. I've tried siphoning them before and hopefully will never have to again.