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More Friggin Infectionshad To Toss Out

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by fergi, 27/3/12.

 

  1. donburke

    Well-Known Member

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    Posted 27/3/12

    i dont see anything glaringly wrong with your procedure

    i still believe you have a small leak in the cube somewhere that has let some air in after it has cooled

    i would have thought that the near boiling hot wort would have dealt with any nasties, and the problem has arisen after the wort has cooled
     
  2. eamonnfoley

    FoleybraĆ¼

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    Posted 28/3/12
    1) Since you have a pump - recirculate for 15-20 mins in last part of boil through your pump and hoses. This will sanitise your transfer equipment and you can effectively rule out the hot side.

    2) Also take your kettle ball valve apart after each brew and soak overnight in cleaner.

    3) Take a sample of your wort from the kettle post boil into a sanitised cup, put some foil on top with lacky-band straight away. This is a wort stability test. Come back in a couple of days and see if it still tastes/looks like unfermented wort - if yes, then you know the problem is in the cube or fermenter (i.e. the cold side).

    4) Make sure your cube is completely full, and dont transfer to the cube at less than about 85C

    5) Dont use any form of "cloth". Get some alfoil. And don't worry about sanitising the mash tun or boil kettle (wort is boiled). Also check your concentration / dilution on your sanitiser. If its an old bottle it may have lost its potency. Maybe try starsan or Iodophor.
     
  3. QldKev

    Brew Dude

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    Posted 28/3/12
    First double check the seals on the cubes. Remove the seal from the lid and clean underneath.
    Also some people say it is a waste. But if I get infections in the cubes I chuck them. $15 for a new cube is easier than another lost batch. (same as fermentors)

    I would also consider getting a new tap and hose, keep the other ones for spares.

    Then get a different sanitizer. If starsan has a different active ingredient give it a spin, otherwise try the good old bleach and vinegar mix.

    edit: I assume the cloth has been immersed in sanatiser prior to use, and you have used different cloths

    Hope this helps

    QldKev
     
  4. hando

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    Posted 28/3/12
    Enjoy the troubleshooting...

    I agree get rid of the sanitised cloth. You could use foil, but I was thinking that nothing would get into the vessel when the air and steam is flowing out.

    When I'm troubleshooting I only change one thing each time to see if that fixed the problem. If you change a whole heap of things then you'll never know which thing was the culprit. Doing this may cost a bit of $ in wasted brew, but could also save you $ if you're not replacing brew equipment and other consumables which you don't need to.

    Good luck
     
  5. Ross

    CraftBrewer

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    Posted 28/3/12
    Fergi,

    Logically, the problem is with your cube, if it it's sealing properly, then crud trapped under the lid seal, in the the tap plug at the base, or up in the handle area, would be the most likely causes. If all look clean, I'd replace the cube.

    Otherwise, the only other really suspect spot (though the pasteurisation time in the cube should eliminate) would be your ball valve from the kettle. If you are dismantling & cleaning it then ignore, but if you are only running sanitiser through it, this is not sufficient, they trap crud that is not removed by running liquid through.


    Good luck in finding....

    Cheers Ross
     
  6. doon

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    Posted 28/3/12
    By rolling cube on its sides to you mean just quickly once each side? I put my cube on its side with the lid and leave like that for a few hours
     
  7. Snow

    Beer me up, Scotty!

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    Posted 28/3/12
    Are you using yeast starters or dry yeast? Might be an issue there.

    Cheers - Snow
     
  8. fergi

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    Posted 28/3/12
    thanks guys for the replies,
    the cubes were brand new, never had wort in them,

    i roll the cubes around then leave them on side for about 5 minutes each side, always have done it this way,

    will use alfoil for covering the hole in future.

    i actually pulled all my ball valves apart before hand ross and cleaned them thoroughly.

    DB i dont think the cube is leaking air in as i would imagine once the cube began to swell up like a soccer ball the pressure would squeeze the wort out of the lid or bung.

    cheers fergi
     
  9. Ross

    CraftBrewer

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    Posted 28/3/12
    Fergi,

    If they are new cubes I'd put money on it being a poorly sealed cube that's sucked in bad air, there really is nothing else it could be looking at your regime.

    It wouldn't necessarily leak once cooled & under postive pressure, the hot cubes are quite soft & could easily have allowed air in before cooling & sealing.
    Looks like you might have a bit of wild yeast floating around your property at present.

    Cheers Ross
     
  10. mfeighan

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    Posted 28/3/12
    i would definitely add that to your regime so you dont have to worry about any nasties that could be there in the valve/pump
     
  11. DKS

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    Posted 28/3/12
    Funny how some things stick in your mind. After reading your posts one thing you said kept recurring to me for days after. It was the little comment that you lifted the cube handle to get a little extra wort in there. Just possible that this is sucking in some nasty little buggers.
    Ive had my share of infections and worked out that the smallest exposure to air at the wrong time can be devistating to a brew.
    There are a few references Ive read to the small drop in temp on the discharge side of a ball valve from the kettle not being adequit to sanitise, so Im never that confident about NC cubes, although thats what I do.
    By known practice, you should be OK into the cube if your sani rageme is what you said. That sucking in by lifting the handle is sticking in my claw still.

    more to that .... Around my way I try not to brew around September / October. Recurring infections reported by a few local brewers each year at the same time. Pollen, wind who knows its just there each year.

    This is a real brainteaser, just thought Ide add my pennies worth and will follow thread with interest.Good luck.
    Daz
     
  12. eamonnfoley

    FoleybraĆ¼

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    Posted 28/3/12
    Thats why I like starsan. When you transfer to a fermenter (or cube in this case), there is a huge head of foam that sits above the wort. This should help kill any airborne wild yeast that might drift into your fermenter at or shortly after transfer.
     
  13. TBird

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    Posted 28/3/12

    I'd back Ross on this one being the poorly sealed cube
     
  14. DKS

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    Posted 28/3/12
    One would like to think so foles but they're sneaky little pricks and they're out to getcha. :p
    Daz
     
  15. kelbygreen

    Crazy Clown

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    Posted 28/3/12
    I have had a cube that had all the air squeezed out the next morning it was back to original shape and had a pocket of air (prob 2lts of liquid worth) on the top. So the lid obviously didnt seal, I squeezed the air back out and the cube had a bump on where the mold was so I trimmed that off and sealed it up. I pitched it that day but it tasted the same as the other cube that didnt let air in. Just lucky I guess.

    But people do get trouble around here to when the wineries start brewing.
     
  16. mje1980

    Old Thunder brewery

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    Posted 28/3/12
    I totally empathise with you!!. I had a bad run with infections. Drove me nuts. I ended up replacing the valve on my kettle ( had a nasty split i didn't see ), got some silicon hose, new cubes etc. I still use the old cubes, after a thorough sod perc soak, then a bleach + vinegar soak, then sod perc again + iodophor haha. Looks like im all good now thankfully.

    Check everything twice , replace if not costly, and don't give up!!!
     
  17. Maheel

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    Posted 28/3/12
    any-chance that the BACBAN is past it's use by date or something or maybe a chance an "error" was made at the butcher shop if your topping up from their larger bottle of the stuff ?

    just thought it was worth a mebtion
     
  18. fergi

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    Posted 28/3/12

    yes i think it has to be a cube problem ROSS,
    i live in the country so we have plenty of wild everything blowing around here.

    one thing is when i filled the cubes i put them straight into my laundry to cool. always done this with no problems.
    fergi
     
  19. Wimmig

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    Posted 28/3/12
    I haven't had any troubles with leaving cubes overnight, days, or a few weeks before pitching. I find the foaming action of starsan pushing out of the cube, then filling the cube until it flows over leaves little room for anything to interfer with.
     
  20. fergi

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    Posted 28/3/12
    i just want to thank all you guys that have taken the time to post an answer,
    they are all worthwhile considerations and i will be triple checking everything next week before i brew my next batch.

    i will also implement a couple of ideas you have thrown up.

    i will also put the hot cubes after i fill them with wort, into a large clear plastic bag that i will spray with sanitiser inside and seal up the bag until i am ready to pitch into a fermenter. this way if the new cubes suck in air it should be clean sanitised air.

    hope my next batch is okay.
    will keep this thread informed, if you dont hear anything then i have probably shot myself.

    fergi

    banghead.gif
     
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