Mash Eff

[wes1977]

What are the top tips on improving mash eff? I'm getting around 75%!

I have a rims kit so I can pretty much hold the temp within 1c

Cheers

Wes

 

[gap]

What is wrong with 75%?
Consistency is more important.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Agreed that consistancy is important.

AG or BIAB ?

Most brewers sit around 75% - which also makes it easier sharing recipes

To get that extra 5% takes a bit of work and comes down to many little improvements to make a big one.

A good crush and about 25-30% flour will help. Also grain conditioning will help get better husks which helps sparging

Play with your mill and make small adjustments to get a good crush

I recirculate the sparge a few times then drain. Use boiling water for sparge water as it will help rinse out the sugars

If your getting 75% consistantly then you should be able to get up to 80%

 

[manticle]

BIAB is ag.

75% brewhouse efficiency is good. Is it mash efficiency or brew house efficiency you're talking about.

http://beersmith.com/blog/2014/11/05/brewhouse-efficiency-vs-mash-efficiency-in-all-grain-beer-brewing/

 

[Coodgee]

Getting your ph optimal for conversion is also a good way to get a few more points of efficiency. You could try a product like ph 5.2. I use it and my efficiency with my grainfather is around 85% total efficiency.

 

[JDW81]

What are the top tips on improving mash eff? I'm getting around 75%!

I have a rims kit so I can pretty much hold the temp within 1c

Cheers

Wes

The biggest question is why do you want to improve your efficiency?

There is a common misconception that higher efficiency means you'll make better beer or you are a better brewer. That is all bollocks. I'd rather run at 70%, hit all my numbers every brew and make great beer than get 85% and be inconsistent with numbers and brew quality.

Are you happy with the beer you make? If yes, then there is no need to change. If no, then I'd suggest it isn't an efficiency issue as higher efficiency doesn't mean better beer.

If you want to improve your total efficiency then you can look at where your biggest losses are and try to reduce those (i.e. aiming for less residual left in your kettle post boil etc).

JD

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

The biggest question is why do you want to improve your efficiency?

There is a common misconception that higher efficiency means you'll make better beer or you are a better brewer. That is all bollocks. I'd rather run at 70%, hit all my numbers every brew and make great beer than get 85% and be inconsistent with numbers and brew quality.

Are you happy with the beer you make? If yes, then there is no need to change. If no, then I'd suggest it isn't an efficiency issue as higher efficiency doesn't mean better beer.

If you want to improve your total efficiency then you can look at where your biggest losses are and try to reduce those (i.e. aiming for less residual left in your kettle post boil etc).

JD

Very true

75% consistently is better than 80% inconsistently

If you now you are going to get 75% all them time it makes it easier as you dont have to modify your recipe to account for the extra gravity

 

[wes1977]

Hi guys, just to confirm I'm referring to Mash Eff, my brew house is between 60 and 65.

Thanks

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

So are we

 

[Midnight Brew]

Hey Wes, a change to rainwater improved my mash efficiency around 5-10%. Other improvements can be made with grain crush as mentioned and water chemistry. There's a pdf floating about "key concepts in water treatment" that I regularly refer to. A great read and I still use it 4 years on in AG brewing.

 

[wes1977]

I thought must people are getting around 80 to 85%.... I'm just curious on what I'm doing wrong.

Like you say I'm happy with the end result but I'm obsessed with fine tunning things!! [emoji3][emoji3][emoji3]

 

[JDW81]

I thought must people are getting around 80 to 85%.... I'm just curious on what I'm doing wrong.

Like you say I'm happy with the end result but I'm obsessed with fine tunning things!! [emoji3][emoji3][emoji3]

Efficiency tends to be a bit of a pissing competition round these parts.

Consistency is far more important to be obsessed with than an arbitrary number which isn't necessarily going to make your beer any better.

If you want to fine tune things look at recipe design, good yeast health and a well controlled ferment. Those things will make far more difference to your beer than an extra 5 efficiency points.

JD

 

[TheWiggman]

That's true but I can't blame someone for wanting to get better efficiency. The ingredients are paid for, they're there in the tun, if it's simple to get an extra litre or 2 then great.
What's your process? BIAB, single vessel, 3 vessel? There are good pointers above which apply to all systems. If however you have a mash tun with a lot of dead space then you'll inherently have unrecoverable sugars. Your sparge process (batch or fly) can have a large impact too.

 

[wes1977]

I have a three vessel system and probably leave a litre behind in my mash tun. I fly sparge but I'm not convinced on my process as I get the same result as batch sparging!

 

[Jack of all biers]

Efficiency tends to be a bit of a pissing competition round these parts.

Consistency is far more important to be obsessed with than an arbitrary number which isn't necessarily going to make your beer any better.

If you want to fine tune things look at recipe design, good yeast health and a well controlled ferment. Those things will make far more difference to your beer than an extra 5 efficiency points.

JD

That's true but I can't blame someone for wanting to get better efficiency. The ingredients are paid for, they're there in the tun, if it's simple to get an extra litre or 2 then great.
What's your process? BIAB, single vessel, 3 vessel? There are good pointers above which apply to all systems. If however you have a mash tun with a lot of dead space then you'll inherently have unrecoverable sugars. Your sparge process (batch or fly) can have a large impact too.

Wes, be careful for what you wish for. JDW81 has some very good points. The extra litre or 2 as mentioned above can come at a price in flavour and longevity of flavour/freshness of the beer.
Go to http://www.thebrewingnetwork.com/?s=efficiency and listen to Jamil and John Palmers Podcasts about efficiency. Then make your mind up as to whether you want to tinker with your method.

 

[TheWiggman]

I have a three vessel system and probably leave a litre behind in my mash tun. I fly sparge but I'm not convinced on my process as I get the same result as batch sparging!

If that's the case your sparge process probably needs review. If you're getting channelling from a poor crush or your sparge is happening too fast then expect poor results. Ideally the sparge water should be spread evenly across the top of the mash tun (like a sparge arm) but you could use devices like a thin aluminium tray with holes in it to distribute the water evenly. I fly sparge and get consistent results with the following -
1. When mash is finished, connect MT drain to kettle
2. Plumb 80°C sparge water to HERMS return and throttle to closed. It's just a piece of silicon hose which meets the level of the mash liquor
3. Open MT drain until desired flow comes out
4. Turn on pump from HLT and open throttling valve so that level of MT liquor is maintained
5. Check regularly and change valve positions to maintain MT level
6. Stir top 1/3 of mash gently every 10 mins or so. I find this minimises channelling.
7. Sparge until HLT liquor is drained, and then completely drain MT to reach desired preboil volume. (This will obviously take some dialling in of the system)
I find that 45 mins if the minimum time to complete sparging. I regularly hit 82-85% efficiency, and find that if I get lower efficiency it's because I accidentally rushed the sparge. I've pushed the sparge out to 2.5h thanks to a stuck mash and that didn't boost my efficiency enough to notice a difference.