March Pump Bleed Valve Location

[Julez]

Hi all,

Does anyone have a bleed valve setup on their vessel outlets, instead of on the pump outlet as I have seen? If so, how have you done this, i.e. what hardware have you used??

I've read a lot of past posts, and there seem to be several approaches to pump configs. My logic is that it is much easier to prime the pump with the inlet at the top, but the only catch is, you need to be able to purge air from the inlet hose at the highest point, which is the kettle/MLT/HLT outlet tap. I have tested this by carefully disconnecting the inlet hose from the vessel outlet and filling from the tap, directly into the disconnected hose and reconnecting when it is full. It works a treat and priming and pump operation is a piece of cake.

So if anyone has set their pump up this way, how have you done it? Or is there an easier way? I have attached a very dodgy drawing to illustrate.

Cheers, Julez :icon_cheers:

 

[AndrewQLD]

Inlet at the bottom means no need for a bleed valve, the air is forced up and out the outlet.

Andrew

 

[Julez]

Hi Andrew,

I guess that does make sense - but is gravity sufficient to push water around the tube bend under the inlet and up through the pump head before turning it on?

Cheers

 

[AndrewQLD]

Hi Andrew,

I guess that does make sense - but is gravity sufficient to push water around the tube bend under the inlet and up through the pump head before turning it on?

Cheers

yep, in fact gravity will pull 1/2 of your liquid through, or until both pots are level.

Andrew

 

[Julez]

Great, sounds good!

I'm off to the garage then...

Thanks! B)

 

[TidalPete]

I'm one of those poor souls who seem to have set up their March pump with the inlet on top only to read in later posts that there was a better way.
I have no trouble with the march losing prime because I bleed any air out of the lines before I start by opening all valves, disconnecting the hose leading to the HE (hanging over the ice-cream container) & then connecting again after all air is expunged. The pic is an older one as I now have another valve on the end of that brass all-thread to ensure that no wort is lost if in the rare event I ever loose prime during the brewing process.

TP

 

[Julez]

Hmmm, I just tried this "inlet at the bottom" method, and it really didn't work too well. In fact, I have the same problem as when it is at the top, that is the inlet tube is full of air that can not be purged.

I have the pump mounted horizontally with the oil holes at the top and the housing now turned upside down, so inlet in at the bottom. Before turning on the pump, I open the valve on the pump outlet, then open the valve on the vessel (let's call it the kettle) outlet. Water trickles down very slowly to the pump inlet. The pump housing doesn't fill with water. So the only way still that I can see is to purge air from the inlet hose by some kind of bleed valve setup.

Really, I get the same problem whatever the housing orientation, but in the "inlet down" method there is even less chance of flooding the housing completely.

Can anyone explain further how to make this work without any mucking about?

 

[TidalPete]

Hmmm, I just tried this "inlet at the bottom" method, and it really didn't work too well. In fact, I have the same problem as when it is at the top, that is the inlet tube is full of air that can not be purged.

I have the pump mounted horizontally with the oil holes at the top and the housing now turned upside down, so inlet in at the bottom. Before turning on the pump, I open the valve on the pump outlet, then open the valve on the vessel (let's call it the kettle) outlet. Water trickles down very slowly to the pump inlet. The pump housing doesn't fill with water. So the only way still that I can see is to purge air from the inlet hose by some kind of bleed valve setup.

Really, I get the same problem whatever the housing orientation, but in the "inlet down" method there is even less chance of flooding the housing completely.

Can anyone explain further how to make this work without any mucking about?

Julez,

If you look closely at my pic you will see that the lowest valve on my setup is a bleeder valve designed for this very purpose.
Cheers & good luck.

TP

 

[Jez]

Does the pump housing fill if you have the outlet hose disconnected from your intended destination valve?

I always make sure the pump outlet hose is flowing by disconnecting and holding it lower than the pump for a few seconds until it flows onto the ground, then close outlet valve, connect to the destination valve and re-open outlet valve.

Works most of the time.

Jez

 

[Julez]

Julez,

If you look closely at my pic you will see that the lowest valve on my setup is a bleeder valve designed for this very purpose.
Cheers & good luck.

TP

How does that work in practise, TP? Do you lose liquid out the bleeder valve? How long does it take for the pump to prime? In your pic, is your setup there with the inlet on top or bottom (I couldn't tell from your initial description whether you have changed your setup to inlet at the bottom, or whether it was just an improvement you had in mind)?

Thanks for the comments and suggestions everyone

 

[AndrewQLD]

All I ever do is open the tap on the vessel to drain (HLT), open the tap on the pump inlet side, open the tap on the pump outlet side, open the tap on the vessel to fill (mash tun). Liquid flows quickly through the pump and starts filling the mash tun, I then turn on the pump.

Andrew

 

[TidalPete]

All I ever do is open the tap on the vessel to drain (HLT), open the tap on the pump inlet side, open the tap on the pump outlet side, open the tap on the vessel to fill (mash tun). Liquid flows quickly through the pump and starts filling the mash tun, I then turn on the pump.

Andrew

Pretty close to my method Andrew & Julez.
Inlet is on the top Julez & when priming before I underlet I open ALL valves bar the HLT, disconnect the hose fitting from the all-thread entry to the HE, turn on the HLT valve & wait 2 or 3 seconds for any air to expel then shut the bleeder valve (6) as well as the HLT (To stop gravity feeding liquor to my MT before I'm ready to measure), re-connect the hose fitting to the HE & then open & shut the valves to get my underlet going as required. No worries at all although if I could be bothered (And I can't) I could easily reconstruct my March pump\ball valve configuration to work with the outlet on the top & inlet underneith as Andrew does which is better IMHO.
Hope this makes sense??

TP

 

[browndog]

As Andrew said, water finds it's own level so if you open the tap on the HLT say, the water should flow though the pump and up to the height in the HLT, here is a pic of mine, never had a prob with priming. Also, you can unscrew the pump head from the motor and rotate it any position you want in relation to the oil holes.




cheers

Browndog

 

[Paul H]

As Andrew said, water finds it's own level so if you open the tap on the HLT say, the water should flow though the pump and up to the height in the HLT, here is a pic of mine, never had a prob with priming. Also, you can unscrew the pump head from the motor and rotate it any position you want in relation to the oil holes.

View attachment 30416


cheers

Browndog

Looks great Tony I reckon you should come over my place & see if you can build it again

Cheers

Paul

 

[TidalPete]

The way I have setup my March may not be the same as others BUT the only real difference in my opinion is the fact that

(1) With the inlet at the top gravity gets rid of any air in my system through the bleed valve pre underletting. This only applies to my setup but I fail to see see why it won't work for others?

(2) With the outlet on top the March (And with higher PSI than gravity) pushes any air out through the MT outlet before underletting takes place.
Horses for courses perhaps?
Happy to be corrected here. :icon_cheers:

TP

 

[sav]

I am wondering will this work ok, I have my hlt and mlt joind to that vertical copper pipe to the tee at the bottom ,I am thinking it will be easier to underlet some grain go before I start to recirculate the wort.
Thanks for any advice.

sav

 

[Mitchell]

I have a bleed valve at the top that I find useful for encouraging things along sometmes.

 

[AndrewQLD]

The way I have setup my March may not be the same as others BUT the only real difference in my opinion is the fact that

(1) With the inlet at the top gravity gets rid of any air in my system through the bleed valve pre underletting. This only applies to my setup but I fail to see see why it won't work for others?

(2) With the outlet on top the March (And with higher PSI than gravity) pushes any air out through the MT outlet before underletting takes place.
Horses for courses perhaps?
Happy to be corrected here. :icon_cheers:

TP

Pete, I would have thought that while gravity will push the wort/water down the laws of something would dictate that air bubbles rise in a fluid, so you are effectively trying to force something (air Bubbles) to travel down that by it's own nature is trying to go up. That's why i think the inlet is best suited at the bottom of the pump.

Andrew

 

[yardy]

so what's the general consensus here brewers, inlet at the bottom or top ?

cheers

 

[kook]

There was a diagram posted a while back from the manufacturer, showing the recommended installation configuration. (see link below)

Basically, you want the inlet facing downwards. This is the correct position to ensure there are no areas where air can be trapped in the pump. It also means that your oil point (see the sticker that says "Oil") will be facing upwards; provided you haven't changed the orientation of the pump head.


http://www.marchpump.com/documents/Installation.pdf