Quokka42 said:
... but I don't understand why some are so anti-JW. ...
Quokka42 said:
.... I know brew shops and hipsters don't like them because they are cheap, and some people just don't like Australia...
....
Rather than wonder why there are
many brewers that prefer other maltsters and go off assuming it's because they're hipsters (let's face it, we could just sub in the word "******") or retailers simply trying to maximise their profits, maybe consider another possibility: that there are quite a few brewers on here who have also been All-Grain brewing for many years, with at least a few decent results, who have tried many different maltsters, and have simply realised that for various styles or just generally across the board, other maltsters produce better malts for their needs.
Have you tried many/any of these other maltster, including the Aussie ones? - I see you've tried some Gladfields spec malts. I'd agree they're great, and some of their specs are quite unique. OTOH, they're also probably one of the farthest to the other end of the spectrum - i.e.: they're some of the highest quality and highest price malts.
FWIW, i'd also be very, very heavily constrained by lack of funds. Luckily i've been able to get onto some bulk buys to get my hands on a variety of the UK, Euro, US, & NZ malts. All are great, with their strengths and weaknesses. The main weakness for most of them is the cost at normal prices!
As has been touched on, there's generally certain malts that are better/best for some styles. When i say that, by the way, that's not necessarily because we're desperately seeking approval for simply using a genuine/authentic/traditional set of ingredients. I think you'll find most good brewers couldn't give a toss about that bollocks. Instead, it's simply a case of certain malts are better at producing a particular flavour that is best for that type of beer.
The easiest example of this that springs to mind is Dingemanns Biscuit. This particular type of biscuity (surprise!) maltiness is perfect (in my experience) for matching the type of flavours that the belgian yeasts produce. I haven't tried the Gladfields version TBH, however i'd definitely say it's better than any other similar malt i've tried. Everything else just doesn't quite blend in as smoothly or enhance the overall beer as much. The others are not necessarily bad, they're just not quite as good, or the resulting beers are just not quite as good. Obviously, this is all in the tastebuds of this beholder!
In comparison to that is, say Simpsons' Amber (a broadly similar malt). Not so great in a belgian or 2 i've tried it in. However, awesome in Ambers, (Pales), Browns, Porters and Stouts. Similarly for Briess' Victory.
This kinda makes sense in that these maltsters have traditionally produced malts for local breweries that produce local styles, so they need to produce the best malts to specifically suit those breweries and the types of beers they have specialised in for many many years. Hence, it's not going to be surprising to find UK maltsters produce some malts that are some of the best for bitters, browns, porters, stouts and other UK styles. Similarly, the german maltster produce malts specifically designed to suit german lagers, Alts/etc, & pilsners; and the Belgian maltster produce some of the best malts for the various belgian styles. Worth noting the US maltster produce certain malts that specifically suit some of their New World styles. Or maybe you could argue that the New World styles have come about because the brewers there have had to try to find recipes that make best use of the local malts ... (at least a bit of the former from what the Briess maltsters have commented on before).
Obviously there're some exceptions.
Now, what local styles do the traditional/long-standing Aussie maltsters need to produce their malts for? Hmmm ... aussie lagers.
Hence, they suit aussie lagers very well.
But for other types of beers, there may be better malts to use.
That's not to say you can't make other great beers from JW. As stated before, many beer styles can be made well from JW, as you can compensate with certain spec malts or just tweak the recipe as best you can to suit. However, it's generally best to use the malts that are better suited to that particular type of beer. Especially for a beer like a pilsner or german lager - given they're ~100% pilsner malt, it doesn't leave much wriggle room to alter the malt element. Hence, there's a lot of
experienced brewers out there/here who recommend Wey pils for a euro lager - because they've tried a few different malts and Wey is the best for their tastes. Or Dingemann. Or Gladfield.
By the way, I'm bothering to write all this because i went through a similar process a few years ago - wondering why JW was used by a lot of brewers, but most recommended certain other maltsters, especially for particular styles. It's taken a few years and many beers later to understand the reasons.
FWIW, have you tried Viking? It's a Finnish maltster. I've been using a fair bit of their Pale Ale & Munich for the last year - cheap as chips, very consistent, and really good for the price. Homemakeit sell in melbourne. Maybe look into it if you're watching the pennies like me. Not aussie, i know, but it's something different for you to consider.
A minor point, the only over-priced/rip-off LHBS i know happens to mainly stock JW.
And i believe retailers typically use a standard markup on the grains in their store. So the price difference you see on different maltsters in a store is probably reflective of the wholesale price they pay, rather than their attempts to rip you off.
And one other thing, when someone says "Czech Pilsner" it's again not because they're simply being twats trying to emulate a traditional style for the sake of it. Most of the time, at least on this forum, they're just using that particular label to simply describe a certain combination/balance of malt, hops & yeast elements that is emulated in a Czech Pils. So rather than spend a paragraph describing exactly what they're after, or what they've achieved, you can simply say "Czech pils" and move on. Some might be a little precious about exactly what a style is, most just see it as a general descriptor guideline.
Happy brewing & keep up the enthusiasm!
