Is coopers halal?

[Dave70]

No, no.. actually it is bigotry.

BIGOT. : a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance.

The key is obstinate and intolerant. Freedom of choice is where you understand an issue then make a decision based on sound reasoning. A knee jerk reaction is biggotry.

This whole anti-halal thing is islamophobia pure and simple. Its intolerance, racism (religionism technically) and biggotry. Its about time we started calling it what it is.

Here, here.

Politicalcorrectapoligeticism it is, since we're getting into neologisms here..

Yes, bigotry is silly and can lead to bad things, but holding ideas in contempt, which is all religion basically is, does not make one racist by any stretch.
Its a pretty hefty salvo to launch at somebody in my opinion Dave.

 

[JDW81]

I'm no racist bigot but I kind of like our free & democratic way of life & if any organization wants to compromise that via a third party, they can kiss my arse & I refuse to support it !

Free and democratic? Like storing metadata to screw journalists who leak stuff that makes the government look bad, dressed up as protection us from all those evil illegal immigrants who wish us harm?

 

[Crusty]

No, no.. actually it is bigotry.

BIGOT. : a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance.

The key is obstinate and intolerant. Freedom of choice is where you understand an issue then make a decision based on sound reasoning. A knee jerk reaction is biggotry.

This whole anti-halal thing is islamophobia pure and simple. Its intolerance, racism (religionism technically) and biggotry. Its about time we started calling it what it is.

What is FREEDOM OF CHOICE?

Unfettered right to do what one wants when one wants as one wants, except where it infringes or prevents another from doing what that one wants, and do so on. Also excluded is doing something that would harm one’s self or another.


Law Dictionary: What is FREEDOM OF CHOICE? definition of FREEDOM OF CHOICE (Black's Law Dictionary)



But your not getting it!

I'm not intolerant of Muslims or their beliefs so I'm no bigot.
But classing me as such because I have an intolerance to extremists or thugs that cut the heads off innocent people to demonstrate their intolerance to our freedom & way of life, well I guess I'm guilty. I don't know 100% if the Halal organization has any dealings with any third party or not but I'm very suspicious. Until It's proven otherwise, I'll enjoy my bacon & alcohol & continue to boycott what I feel is suspicious, freedom of choice right? SEE ABOVE FOR CLARIFICATION!

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

FFS...eating Halal cert products wont turn you into a Terrosrist as eating a salad wont turn you into a vegetarian.

And why are people ONLY against Halal certification. What about Kosher...or Organic Cert ( and by the way organic certification is mainly done by private business who are out to make money from it ) or the Heart Tick ( who also approve some McDonalds products ) or MSA Beef...or the MArine Stward Council cert for seafood....its endless


So why pick on Halal...why....some one please explain why without mentioning the words Terrorist, Islam, ISIS..etc

ALL the businesses who provide the certifications are private businesses. They are ALL out to make money. Halal cert is no different to ANY OTHER certification with respect to making money from it.

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

What is FREEDOM OF CHOICE?

Unfettered right to do what one wants when one wants as one wants, except where it infringes or prevents another from doing what that one wants, and do so on. Also excluded is doing something that would harm one’s self or another.
Law Dictionary: What is FREEDOM OF CHOICE? definition of FREEDOM OF CHOICE (Black's Law Dictionary)



But your not getting it!

I'm not intolerant of Muslims or their beliefs so I'm no bigot.
But classing me as such because I have an intolerance to extremists or thugs that cut the heads off innocent people to demonstrate their intolerance to our freedom & way of life, well I guess I'm guilty. I don't know 100% if the Halal organization has any dealings with any third party or not but I'm very suspicious. Until It's proven otherwise, I'll enjoy my bacon & alcohol & continue to boycott what I feel is suspicious, freedom of choice right? SEE ABOVE FOR CLARIFICATION!

So it's your suspicion that's uninformed bigotry, not your boycott?

 

[Crusty]

So it's your suspicion that's uninformed bigotry, not your boycott?

I don't care what you want to call it really.
My choice, my decision.
I'm not having a go at anybody that supports Halal, that's your choice but I'll boycott & purchase what I darn well please. Period!

 

[QldKev]

Maybe a few could have a read of this Australian Government document

also this website gives some opinions worth a read



I'm not arguing for/against, just posting these links

 

[Blind Dog]

Maybe a few could have a read of this Government document

http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/current%20series/rpp/100-120/rpp114/06_misuse.html

A link to a page telling me that the AIC is redeveloping its website is, I assume, an ironic reference to the relevance of the topic heading (or a diabolical plot by halal certified vegetarian extremists to undermine something extremely impotent)

EDIT - the other link deserves nothing but disdain given its uninformed opinionated drivel

 

[Liam_snorkel]

Heh, is that second link satire? I can't tell.

 

[Dave70]

And why are people ONLY against Halal certification. What about Kosher..

Yeah, what about it. Remember this?

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/opinion/anti-israel-bullies-hard-centre-bites-in-chocolate-shop-campaign/story-e6frgd0x-1226118406097

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

I don't care what you want to call it really.
My choice, my decision.
I'm not having a go at anybody that supports Halal, that's your choice but I'll boycott & purchase what I darn well please. Period!

It's not even about "supporting" or halal. I don't "support" halal. I don't care about halal. If I am in a shop and I need a steak, the halal nature of the meat won't effect my decision because it has nothing to do with me.

It becomes even more stark with malt. There is no moral in malt. It's grain. If the supplier has made it in a way that makes it acceptable to those with strict beliefs, it is no skin off mine or anyone else's nose.

The grain isn't malted at cruel temperatures, it's not blessed by satan, and it's not funding terrorism. It's grain.

 

[Airgead]

Freedom of choice and bigotry are not mutually exclusive. You do indeed have free choice to boycott halal. Essentially you have free choice to be a bigot. Its a free choice... it doesn't mean its a good choice or a pleasant choice.

Lets not hide behind freedom of choice here. What you are really saying is that I am free to hold a prejudiced and bigoted opinion based entirely on suspicion and supposition with no basis in fact. Yes, indeed you are.

Lets call this anti halal frenzy what it is - its a mix of islamophobia, xenophobia and in a lot of cases, more that a little racism as well. You are perfectly free to hold those views, but lets not pretend this is all about freedom of choice.

 

[QldKev]

A link to a page telling me that the AIC is redeveloping its website is, I assume, an ironic reference to the relevance of the topic heading (or a diabolical plot by halal certified vegetarian extremists to undermine something extremely impotent)

EDIT - the other link deserves nothing but disdain given its uninformed opinionated drivel

I've fixed up the first link

 

[Liam_snorkel]

the first link is more to-do with people setting up smaller charities and using them to funnel $$ to dodgey causes / funding self interest / backdoor political donations - and bypassing scrutiny. That is a huge problem in Aus, but there isn't any evidence that Halal Australia are doing this or breaking the law. EDIT: and if there was, seriously, the AFP & ASIO would be all over that ****. Do these facebook crusaders seriously think that they have more information & a better idea than them?

Meanwhile THIS makes my blood boil: http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/backgroundbriefing/2014-07-06/5562744

 

[elcarter]

I've done two tours of the middle east and rode a motorcycle from KL to Bangkok. Quite a lot of travel elsewhere as well.

Both area's religious beliefs are primary Muslim.

From my experiences if you were to generalize each encounter I had in both regions they are very different from one another.

I for one, do not like the way the majority of the middle east Muslims treat one another and external populations with "insert belief system here". I believe this is solely based on the religion they hold dear and the perpetuation of handed down beliefs.

These places are their own, I have no right to dictate how they live and what they do. I'm happy they are able to influence their own environment as this is what I wish for myself and my fellow Australians (what ever race, color or religion they hold dear).

If however a religion / race / color (alien) begins to "negatively" effect our / my environment in anyway they have exceeded their boundaries of rightful influence and I oppose this.

I can see the glaringly obvious hypocritical nature of my beliefs may seem to some by aiding the US / Coalition. However what the media portrays and what what achieved is very different and I cannot expect many to agree.

Now because I have been educated and experienced their customs first hand and share a negative view of certain Muslim's am I considered a bigot? If so I'm at peace with that.

I'm sure some will enjoy picking apart what I have written to prove or disprove what ever personal beliefs they have as many "racists" and "Anti racists" continue to do on this subject.

These are my beliefs from my experiences and information I have read and believed to be true. They will not sit well with everyone and nor should they.

The whole belief that the all inclusive, moral correct, politically correct non offensive pursuit to everything is the correct one is fundamentally flawed.

I am glad though that people are talking about it. I just hope it continues to be informative and constructive. Not transgress into future violence against any.

Edit; I have not researched or experienced much to do with the Halal certification so I'm yet to really form an opinion based on fact.

I do believe though after reading this thread if a differing process must be taken to achieve this certification then those that wish to buy it should have a different packaging and price to support it. Those that do not should have the option to choose not support this. Beautiful idea but very impracticable to implement as a business.

My reasoning is if you choose to give to a church that money will / may help promote / support that particular religion. I have the freedom to choose if I wish to do this by giving / not giving. Same with charities. Halal certified across the board gives me no option.

For grain in this example no process was changed and the certification was basically a rubber stamp I have no issue with this except the once off application proceeds.

I would like to see a " this product does not need a halal certification" rather than halal certified.

 

[wereprawn]

FFS...eating Halal cert products wont turn you into a Terrosrist as eating a salad wont turn you into a vegetarian.

And why are people ONLY against Halal certification. What about Kosher...or Organic Cert ( and by the way organic certification is mainly done by private business who are out to make money from it ) or the Heart Tick ( who also approve some McDonalds products ) or MSA Beef...or the MArine Stward Council cert for seafood....its endless


So why pick on Halal...why....some one please explain why without mentioning the words Terrorist, Islam, ISIS..etc

ALL the businesses who provide the certifications are private businesses. They are ALL out to make money. Halal cert is no different to ANY OTHER certification with respect to making money from it.

You will find that not all halal certification bodies in Australia are private businesses. Some are charitable organizations.

 

[Dave70]

Freedom of choice and bigotry are not mutually exclusive. You do indeed have free choice to boycott halal. Essentially you have free choice to be a bigot. Its a free choice... it doesn't mean its a good choice or a pleasant choice.

Lets not hide behind freedom of choice here. What you are really saying is that I am free to hold a prejudiced and bigoted opinion based entirely on suspicion and supposition with no basis in fact. Yes, indeed you are.

Lets call this anti halal frenzy what it is - its a mix of islamophobia, xenophobia and in a lot of cases, more that a little racism as well. You are perfectly free to hold those views, but lets not pretend this is all about freedom of choice.

I still don't get how rejecting halal makes someone racist. If I start a thread railing against MSG am I automatically prejudiced toward Chinese people?

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

You will find that not all halal certification bodies in Australia are private businesses. Some are charitable organizations.

Charitable organisations ( as are NGO's ) are BIG business, dont be fooled that they are not. Its not like the little old ladies from the CWA selling scones at the school fete.

It is still Privately run, whether it be a Business, NGO or Charity.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

I still don't get how rejecting halal makes someone racist. If I start a thread railing against MSG am I automatically prejudiced toward Chinese people?

I am sure if you search Facebook you will come up with an " Australians Against MSG funding the communist party " group

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

also this website gives some opinions worth a read

You have got to be kidding me. That site is just plain outright ********, hate, racism and prejudice...

A fantastic example of a web site sprouting ******** and miss information. Believe anything on there the you truly need a reality check