Imperial Aussie Pale Ale

[RobboMC]

After looking at the Old Ale and 'imperial' styles my crazy thought is to make Imperial Aussie Pale Ale
with a 2 can of Coopers and some extra bits.

So far the recipe looks like this:
Volume 22 litres abv about 8%

2 x Coopers Aussie Pale Ale
1.5 kg can of Morgans Caramalt
0.3kg Raw Sugar
0.5kg dme
25g Goldings boiled 10 min

Yeast - cultured Pale Ale stubbies

Has anyone ever done anything like this? Did it work?

Any suggestions?

 

[.DJ.]

golding would create an english style ale really...

what are "australian" hops anyway? POR? Is Galaxy australian even though they throw out american "C" type flavours??

 

[Bribie G]

POR isn't a good aroma hop and with two cans of the Coopers Ale, no further bittering would be required. However what I would do is:

2 cans Coopers Lager
1.5 Morgans
500 white sugar
200 light crystal malt steeped

20g POR 20 minutes as a flavouring hop addition, and a little bitterness. Using the lager, which is fairly lightly bittered, you could get away with the POR.

 

[Barley Belly]

Isn't the Cooper's Pale Ale kit less bitter than the Lager???

 

[Fourstar]

POR isn't a good aroma hop and with two cans of the Coopers Ale, no further bittering would be required. However what I would do is:

I disagree, as he is imperialising it with two cans AND extras, a decent whack of bittering will come from the two cans but IMO i dont think its enough to keep it balanced the same as a standard aussie pale. Here's why.

I believe he will probabaly will need to up the bittering slightly as .7-.8 is the BU:GU Ratio of an aussie pale and will need to try and get the FG down to atleast to 1.010 to help dry it out and keep it within the style. Sugaz is the right approach with this.

Infact i would omit the DME altogether and go straight with 800g of sugar. After all, 15% of sugar in an estimated DME equivilant total weight isnt a big issue if its fermented cool then ramped in the finish to control any excessive esters.

Also, two cans of pale ale is only 50 IBU ~. i'd be shooting for 60 IBU to keep it more in the middle ground of the balance.

As for POR not being a good finishing hop, i'd agree. Superpride on the other hand... try it. Its delicious! :icon_drool2:

I will find out how good it is at beerfest with my pale ale category entry I just hope it hasn't mellowed too much sitting in my crawlspace. *fingers crossed*

 

[Bribie G]

Isn't the Cooper's Pale Ale kit less bitter than the Lager???

You're right, I just checked the Coopers site. I'd been getting confused with another kit in the range. Superpride is indeed a great hop.

 

[drsmurto]

POR isn't a good aroma hop

I disagree.

BigHolty proved that to me and others in the AMB single hop challenge last year. His was one of my favourite beers and one i will be trying with my homegrown POR.

The recipe was (Yes its AG but it demonstrates my point)

80% Ale malt
15% Munich 1
5% Caramunich
Hops at 60 to adjust total IBU to 35 IBU with an OG of 1.050
1g/L at 20 mins
1.5g/L at 0 mins
WY 1056 or USO5 (dry or liquid)

Gorgeous beer, turned me back onto POR. I believe he used flowers rather than pellets.

I am intrigued by the idea of an aussie IPA/IIPA

To make this post vaguely on topic i would use POR for the late additions in your toucan if you want to make an aussie IIPA. The issue as i see it is you wont have the bitterness. Each Coopers Pale Ale tin contributes 18.5 IBU per 23L giving you a total of 37 IBU plus whatever you get from a short boil.

If you ditched the caramalt and used 3 tins you would get ~60 IBU. Some might argue this is IPA territory not IIPA.......

The real ale tin is 30 IBU per 23L so maybe use that?

Just my 2 c
DrSmurto

EDIT - way too slow with the calculations....

 

[Fourstar]

The issue as i see it is you wont have the bitterness. Each Coopers Pale Ale tin contributes 18.5 IBU per 23L giving you a total of 37 IBU plus whatever you get from a short boil.

i dont think thats correct smurto. i believe the ibu counts need to be multiplied by the weight of the can then divided by the total volume of the wort.

so: 340 IBU * 1.7kg = 578 / 23L = 25.13 IBU or *2 = 50.26 for a toucan batch @ 23L

Close to being in balance like i pointed out earlier, but slightly under. 10 IBU more is within the middle range of balance for a Aussie pale.

 

[drsmurto]

I pinched those numbers straight from here without bothering to read or figure out if the calculations are correct - Link

When doing kits i always worked off those numbers.

A quick look at the calcs in the spreadsheet indicates the formula used was IBU/volume x 1.25.

Not sure where the 1.25 comes from but then i don't know why you use the weight of the tin either

 

[Fourstar]

Not sure where the 1.25 comes from but then i don't know why you use the weight of the tin either

Its what coopers describe in their FAQ page. i believe all of their stats are calculated per 1kg so you need to ramp it to 1.7 to get the tin equivilant then by the dilution for your wort total.

 

[RobboMC]

Looking at the BJCP guidleines for Old Ale the IBU is 30-60+
so 50 looks great, I might even up the dme and move the balance
sweeter.

Overall Impression: An ale of significant alcoholic strength..... Usually tilted toward a sweeter, maltier balance.

The real question is what hop to use.

I once read here that the commercial PA used Styrian Goldings,
anyone know where to get a small amount, like 50g?

 

[Fourstar]

Looking at the BJCP guidleines for Old Ale the IBU is 30-60+
so 50 looks great, I might even up the dme and move the balance
sweeter.
Overall Impression: An ale of significant alcoholic strength..... Usually tilted toward a sweeter, maltier balance.
The real question is what hop to use.
I once read here that the commercial PA used Styrian Goldings,
anyone know where to get a small amount, like 50g?

Wait, im confuesd. Are you trying to make an old ale now or an imperialised version of an aussie pale? Just so you know, an imperialised aussie pale isnt really an old ale. Infact, its nothing like it. Old ales are usually laden with dark crysal qualities, some adjunct such as molasses, a touch of roast malts for colour, start at high gravity and low attenuation to keep the body up and palate full and syrupy.

If you want an imperialised pale ale, you are simply making a pale ale but jumping the alcohol up whilst keeping it all in balance and still being a pale ale style. As i noted earlier with maintaining the BU:GU balance etc, etc. Unfortuantly there is no style guideline you can work off for imperialising it bar the aussie pale one. if you use something else, it wont really be an aissue pale anymore.

What you would want is clean and fruity esters, dry, spritzy, hoppy, clean malt etc and not a full bodied, super malty hop monster.