How much space for grain?

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Matplat

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Evening all,

I am thinking about doing a partial because the recipe i want to do needs munich extract, but i can't get any at a reasonable price, i can however get munich and vienna malt.

For the recipe I would need to mash 3kg of grain and at 3L per kilo that is 9L. I have an 11L pot and just wondering if it will all fit?

I will then rinse the grain bag in my big W pot.... why not mash in the bigW pot i hear you ask...?

The smaller pot has a heavier base which seems like it would hold the temp more stable, plus if i had to rinse in the smaller pot i have to rinse in less water as i will be adding wet grain which obviously takes up more room than dry grain!
 
kevo said:
BOOM! hit that one out of the park :)

Apparently it would just fit, meaning it probably wouldn't when you allow for things swilling around....

I guess I'l just drop the ratio to 2.5L per kg to allow myself a bit of room in the pot.

Thanks!
 
Matplat said:
Evening all,

I am thinking about doing a partial because the recipe i want to do needs munich extract, but i can't get any at a reasonable price, i can however get munich and vienna malt.

For the recipe I would need to mash 3kg of grain and at 3L per kilo that is 9L. I have an 11L pot and just wondering if it will all fit?

I will then rinse the grain bag in my big W pot.... why not mash in the bigW pot i hear you ask...?

The smaller pot has a heavier base which seems like it would hold the temp more stable, plus if i had to rinse in the smaller pot i have to rinse in less water as i will be adding wet grain which obviously takes up more room than dry grain!
You will struggle to do 3kgs in an 11L pot. I BIAB using a 15L pot & the maximum grain I can do without drastically compromising efficiency is about 3.4kgs - MAX
I have mashed up to 3.9kgs but the efficiency nosedives
 
Thanks for that Stewy,

Are you doing a no-sparge BIAB?

I was planning on mashing in the 11L pot then dunk sparging in the 19L pot (Which would improve efficiency right?). Combine the two in the 19L pot then split up between the two, dilute to achieve max pre-boil volume and do a split boil, combine all in a no-chill cube after adding DME. A bit of a **** around but it's what I've got!
 
I BIAB AG and mostly mash, using a 24L pot for mashing and a 16L pot for dunk sparging or rinsing, when I do that. Several observations:

1. I assume from what you say about a heavier base and keeping temp stable that you're heating during the mash. If you must do so, get a colander ring for the bottom. But there's no need. None. That much mass cools slowly. If you insulate, the drop will be negligible over an hour or 90 minutes. I calculate strike temp, stir in grain, cover, drop pot in a cardboard box lined with earth wool, close box, throw blanket or towels over box and wait. Then you can use the larger pot for mashing. If you want a step mash, start thick and add boiling water, or decoct. That won't work if you have multiple steps, but why do that with your setup.

2. Even 2.5 kg is pretty crowded, and you will need a rinse or sparge to get any reasonable efficiency. The water should be warm but does not have to be at the usual sparge temps.

3. Keep rinse or sparge water pH down with salts or a few drops of food-grade acid, preferably lactic. Even at cool temps I have found some tannic acid extraction occurs if the pH of grain/water mix gets high
 
Nah, wasn't gonna heat while mashing, just thought that a heavier base would help reduce loss.

Righto, mash in the larger pot in 12L of water then dunk sparge in 6L in the smaller pot etc.

Where do you get lactic acid? can I just use lemon juice?

Cheers, Matt
 
Well-stocked LHBS have lactic. Lemon juice would work, but it's weaker, and you might need to add a tsp or two. That probably wouldn't qualify the brew as a shandy. Also, supermarkets usually have pure citric acid, for making jams and the like. You'd be all right with a quarter tsp, and a container would last a very long time.
 
Matplat said:
Thanks for that Stewy,

Are you doing a no-sparge BIAB?

I was planning on mashing in the 11L pot then dunk sparging in the 19L pot (Which would improve efficiency right?). Combine the two in the 19L pot then split up between the two, dilute to achieve max pre-boil volume and do a split boil, combine all in a no-chill cube after adding DME. A bit of a **** around but it's what I've got!
haha. I do a similar amount of ******* around. I do sparge also. Have started squeezing life out of the bag also after reading that astringency is more to do with PH than anything else - no astringency found.
Another thing I do is put 3.4kgs of base malt & steep specialty malts separately, then combine the lot. It means I can do 4.2kg+ & still get good efficiency. I only do 15L batches... I use 3pots though.to be honest, once you have your procedure dialled in its not that much ******* around
 
I manage to do 3.7 kg, but have pushed it to 4, in a maybe15 ltr pot. It fits snuggly in an insulating-bag. Then covered with blankets it hardly drops temperature more than 1.5c over 3 hours. Once in a hour I swear it dropped only 0.2. Lift then dump bag with 3.5 ltr 80deg sparge(?) water in bigW, lift and add to 15 ltr pot then boil. Works a treat in limited space.
 
yankinoz said:
Well-stocked LHBS have lactic. Lemon juice would work, but it's weaker, and you might need to add a tsp or two. That probably wouldn't qualify the brew as a shandy. Also, supermarkets usually have pure citric acid, for making jams and the like. You'd be all right with a quarter tsp, and a container would last a very long time.
I have been debating whether to mess around with water pH as this is my first mash, or leave tweaking like that for later. I will be using rainwater as our RO tap water tastes crap.

The other element in the equation is the Spec malts, I will be using 250g CaraBohemian which I can throw in with the rest of the mash, or do the same as Stewy and steep that separately.

If it can't do any harm adding qtr tsp citric to the mash I suppose it's worth doing, what say you gents?
 
If you mash in the 19L pot filled to the brim, that would give you about 6:1 water/grain ratio and chances are you won't need any form of sparging! This is the beauty of BIAB
 
Acidifying mash water and acidifying sparge water are two different things. You can drop mash water pH too much, but the possible harm from overacidified sparge water pH is slight.

Given your recipe, unless your water is fairly hard from carbonates, you'll probably be okay without adjusting mash pH. Acidify the sparge water if you sparge. One note: if your Big W kettle is 19L and you have 3 kg of grain, your water to grain ratio will likely be under 5. Three kg of grain displaces about 2.25 litres once it is saturated with water, but more that that while the water is still soaking in. So 5.6 is your theoretical max ratio, while under 5 would allow for a higher initial displacement and keep from making a mess.

If this advice is not too late, mash with your water as is and try to calculate your mash efficiency. If you get good conversion, your water is okay for light-coloured brews, but probably not for porters and stouts.

Long term, if you want to brew a variety of styles, either use 5.2 buffer where you need to, or start using a brewing water calculator.

I BIAB up to 4 kg of grain in up to 16L of water, in a 24L kettle, but adjust pH. When I sparge, I use a 16L pot.
 
Thanks mate things have changed slightly and I am going to do a brown ale as my first partial instead of combining my first partial with my first lager.

I will be using rain water, with that in mind do you think I will need to acidify the mash?

Cheers, Matt
 
Rain water might be a bit soft for a brown ale, maybe have search for water adjustments for rain water
 
I haven't got anything to add to the thread other than to say that i'm drinking my first partial now and the results are excellent, love this method
 
I got a water report for my local town water, which was surpisingly comprehensive! According to John Palmers spreadsheet I need to add 2g gypsum to my mash water, and something to acidify my sparge water, where do you get hydrochloric acid from? I ain't gonna be getting back to the LHBS to get lactic before I do this brew.... Or I might just end up using citric from woolies.
 
Missed this thread. When I was doing partials the best I could get out of a 10L stockpot was 2.5 kilos, with a bit of sparging through a SS mesh strainer from a cheap shop. As suggested why not pop down to your Dalby Big W and grab an 18l stockpot, they usually have them for under $20 and if you go full-mash you'll still find plenty of uses for it.
 
You should be able to get Hydrochloric from your local pool shop Matplat.
 
Bribie G said:
Missed this thread. When I was doing partials the best I could get out of a 10L stockpot was 2.5 kilos, with a bit of sparging through a SS mesh strainer from a cheap shop. As suggested why not pop down to your Dalby Big W and grab an 18l stockpot, they usually have them for under $20 and if you go full-mash you'll still find plenty of uses for it.
Yeah, I've ended up doing exactly that....according to brewmate I will have a 17L total volume mash in one pot, then I will dunk sparge in the second with another 11L, then top up with 5L ish, blend the two before boiling....
 
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