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Wasabi

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OK,

Now I'm really confused!

I put one of John Palmers recipes (Victory and CHAOS IPA, pg236) into Strange Brew ( and a few other brew programs) and I'm getting my head all messed up. According to these programs if I put the amount of hops he says should be done, for the length of time he says I'm getting IBU
readings of around 100. This is way out of the 40-60 range that an IPA is supposed to be.

Now he explains this in his book (well try's to, but maths was never my strong point) on pg 62-65) He says that because his recipes only use a 3 gallon pot and he adds 2 gallons of cold afterwards, that the higher gravity of the wort effects the extraction efficiency from the
hops.


Like John, I don't have a 19Litre pot for my stove, so I do a similar thing and boil up my wort in a 6 litre pot (or there abouts), and top it up with water. Is this really going to effect the bitterness of my recipes that much?

Basically if this is true then all these recipes that I have done in StrangeBrew are going to be VERY under hopped. The difference only
seems to be big for the bittering hops (60 mins) and only slight difference for the flavouring and aroma boils.

I've spent the evening with Excel and have worked out how to correct the recipes, but I just can't believe how much extra hops you need if you are boiling a high gravity wort.

Do I just say to hell with it, buy myself a two ring burner and start boiling the whole wort in my Tooheys Keg?

Might explain why a few of my beers haven't been as hoppy as I would have liked.

GMK: You're into your hops, how do you get around this?
 

GMK

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Wasabi

I use a 20 ltr ss pot...
Usually boil between 6 and 10 ltrs.

Now,
I dont use promash or any brewing programs....i just add the hops that i want usually in handfulls - approx 15gms.
I dry hop in 15 or 25 gm quantities.

Therefore, i dont measure IBU's - i dont care - if it tastes Ok - then it is ok.

I know that this is not really helping you - but just add the hops to taste. If one batch is under hop- compensate in the next batch.

Now when i make my IPA- i usually use 30 gms POR or Nth Brewer for the 30 min boil - EKG for the last 10 mins - 15gms.

Then dry hop with 30 gms of EKG or Nth Brewer.
 

Jazman

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does dry hoppiong make much of a difference compered to the last 15 min of a boil i heard that it is not worth it any ideas?????????????
 

Trev

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Wasabi

If I remember right you're not doing all grain (yet) so I'm guessing that it's an extract recipe.

We know that high gravity boils have lower hop extraction efficiency, we also know that these days the liquid malts we get are already boiled and relatively sterile so why not use a lot less of them in the boil??

Add the remainder at the end, just to ensure homogenisation (spelling is definately not my strongpoint :) ).

This way you'll get maximum extraction!

All in all though, I agree with Ken. Just keep trying and modifying till you're happy.

See ya on the 5th ;)

Trev
 

Trough Lolly

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Trev (and anyone else reading this),

What would happen if I boiled 6 litres of water with hops only and after doing the bittering and finishing, I add my LME at the end (immediately after I turn off the burner) before the wort drops below 80 to 90C?

Is this a recipe for disaster? :blink:

Do the hops need to "bind" with the LME in the boil or can I simply turn off the heater, pour in the malt extract, stir it through and then chill down the wort before whacking it in the primary and topping up with cold water?
 

Gough

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Trough Lolly, (top name by the way...)

I've been doing all unhopped extract brews, recently with grains, over the last 5 months - about 7 or 8 brews worth I think. I thought about this problem and use a solution suggested by the bloke at my local HBS which has so far worked really well. I have a 19 litre pot and boill 13 litres of water in it before adding half of whatever my extract/grain wort bill may be. This achieves a gravity roughly similar to my final gravity in which to boil my bittering hops. I throw the final half of my extract in with 10 mins to go just before my final hop addition and I also dry hop. I've heard you can just boil your hops up in water and add the extract later, but I've also been told that it is an advantage to 'key' the hops into your malt by boiling them with some malt at least. The half and half method has worked well for me, and makes IBU calculations fairly straightforward. Hope this helps.

Shawn.
 

Trough Lolly

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G'day Shawn,

Thanks for that...

Yes the name goes back a while now - I had a few too many one night and a navy mate said I was as pi$$ed as a trough lolly and the term kinda stuck! :p

The way I look at it, if I need 3Kg of malt for a 22L brew and I boil say 8 litres of water, then I just add about one third of the malt and chuck in the bittering hops to avoid overloading the SG and hammer the extraction efficiency of the hops. I suppose I can always drop the rest of the malt extract in later.

I guess the best way to learn is to do heaps of brews until I find the right mix!! :D

Cheers,

Rowan
 

Gough

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"Pi$$ed as a trough lolly" LOL :lol: Gotta love those nicknames...

Shawn.
 

Snow

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Jazzman,

in response to your question, In my experience, dry hopping definitely gives you a superior fresh hop aroma than the last minutes of the boil.

Cheers - Snow
 

GMK

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IMO Dry Hopping is the best $value in using your hops....

Especially over late hopping the boil.

You use less hops with dry hopping than with late edition and get more out of them - especially aroama.

Good Value :D
 

Trev

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Trough Lolly,

Yeah, I've started doing extract brews by boiling only some of the extract in about 10 litres of water, adding the hops as per the schedule and then chucking the rest of the malt in at the end. This means that my boil is about the right SG. I believe, but can't quote the details, that just boiling the hops in just water for an extended period will not produce the right result - incorrect flavouring componants/oils (coluholms?) come out into suspension and you end up with a bitterness that is acrid rather than pleasant. Has anybody here researched this ????

So far it seems to be working, I have had one brew that I kegged already consumed and another two that are cold conditioning at the moment. I'll let you know any successes (or failures :angry: )

As for the Dry Hopping, it really is a great way to go - good results for extract and Kit brewers alike. make up Kens (GMK) australian lager and you'll see what I mean.

Trev
 

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