Help! I Stalled My Cider!

[goatus]

Hi all,

I made up a cider with a combination of preservative free apple juice and apple and pear juice from the supermarket, threw some Nottingham and yeast nutrient in there.

SG was 1.043 - 7 days in at 14 degrees it was down to 1.020 so I thought i would rack to secondary and let it ferment the last of its gravity points away from the yeast cake (as i do successfully with beer) - I ramped the temperature up to 18 degrees to ensure it kept active. Unfortunately now, 4 days after racking, we are still at 1.020. I didn't realise Nottingham was so temperamental. What should I do? If I had known it was that easy to stop fermentation with this yeast, I probably would have done it closer to 1.010 and then kegged it for a sweeter cider [put in the toolkit for next time]. 1.020 is too sweet though (and not boozey enough).

I've given her a bit of a gentle swirl, there has surely got to be enough yeast cells still in there - There was a party at the top when i racked it. I have no more Nottingham to pitch, in fact the only yeast i have got on hand is US-05 which I could harvest from my current beer krausen (would this still want to chow down on apple juice now its tasted malty goodness?).

Suggestions appreciated.

Cheers
goatus

P.S. Adding more yeast nutrient helpful/harmful at this point? Im thinking i may have racked all of it out if it dropped with the yeast cake?

 

[fcmcg]

Hi all,

I made up a cider with a combination of preservative free apple juice and apple and pear juice from the supermarket, threw some Nottingham and yeast nutrient in there.

SG was 1.043 - 7 days in at 14 degrees it was down to 1.020 so I thought i would rack to secondary and let it ferment the last of its gravity points away from the yeast cake (as i do successfully with beer) - I ramped the temperature up to 18 degrees to ensure it kept active. Unfortunately now, 4 days after racking, we are still at 1.020. I didn't realise Nottingham was so temperamental. What should I do? If I had known it was that easy to stop fermentation with this yeast, I probably would have done it closer to 1.010 and then kegged it for a sweeter cider [put in the toolkit for next time]. 1.020 is too sweet though (and not boozey enough).

I've given her a bit of a gentle swirl, there has surely got to be enough yeast cells still in there - There was a party at the top when i racked it. I have no more Nottingham to pitch, in fact the only yeast i have got on hand is US-05 which I could harvest from my current beer krausen (would this still want to chow down on apple juice now its tasted malty goodness?).

Suggestions appreciated.

Cheers
goatus

P.S. Adding more yeast nutrient helpful/harmful at this point? Im thinking i may have racked all of it out if it dropped with the yeast cake?

Mate,
Lets get Nottingham sorted first....it's an ale yeast...and its best temps are 14 to 21 but it can go as low as 12 . Dropping temp to 10 would not work.
As you have said , giving it a gentle swirl and increasing the temp a bit are all ways to try and get it to kick off again.
Here is a thread that discusses similar problems and doing a "forced ferment" to see if your cider has gone as far as its going to .linky
You could try top cropping too...but be quick ...you want it at high krausen...
I wouldn't worry about yeast nutrient , if you do top crop , but i guess it couldnt hurt either , if its handy...
When i did the cider you suggest , i used s-04 ( as per the linky)
Hope this helps
Good luck !
Ferg

 

[InCider]

Hey Goatus, when you pitched what was the temp of the cider wort? 7 Days should be enough for nottingham - even at really low temp it chilled to. A starter would almost make a difference too.
How does it taste? It might be ready I don't rack to secondary due to unnecessary risk of infection - nor do I use a hydrometer - it takes the romance away from brewing! Let everything ferment for 2 weeks, on the yeast cake.

InCider.

Hi all,

I made up a cider with a combination of preservative free apple juice and apple and pear juice from the supermarket, threw some Nottingham and yeast nutrient in there.

SG was 1.043 - 7 days in at 14 degrees it was down to 1.020 so I thought i would rack to secondary and let it ferment the last of its gravity points away from the yeast cake (as i do successfully with beer) - I ramped the temperature up to 18 degrees to ensure it kept active. Unfortunately now, 4 days after racking, we are still at 1.020. I didn't realise Nottingham was so temperamental. What should I do? If I had known it was that easy to stop fermentation with this yeast, I probably would have done it closer to 1.010 and then kegged it for a sweeter cider [put in the toolkit for next time]. 1.020 is too sweet though (and not boozey enough).

I've given her a bit of a gentle swirl, there has surely got to be enough yeast cells still in there - There was a party at the top when i racked it. I have no more Nottingham to pitch, in fact the only yeast i have got on hand is US-05 which I could harvest from my current beer krausen (would this still want to chow down on apple juice now its tasted malty goodness?).

Suggestions appreciated.

Cheers
goatus

P.S. Adding more yeast nutrient helpful/harmful at this point? Im thinking i may have racked all of it out if it dropped with the yeast cake?

 

[goatus]

Hi guys,

Pitched at 18 degrees and ramped down to 14 degrees over a day. Only sprinkled onto the wort, no starter, so may have taken longer than it should have to start.

Ferg, I dont understand, why would I drop it to 10 degrees?

Its still at 18 degrees.. should i take it up to 20 to try and kick start her? With only 20 grav points left would it throw off any bad flavours at this point at a higher temp? I have always been told to ferment cider as cool as possible.

I have never used pear juice before - I heard it has more unfermentable sugars than apple - would that mean a higher FG than just apple cider? Surely not 20 points though?

Cheers for your help gents.

 

[fcmcg]

Hi guys,

Pitched at 18 degrees and ramped down to 14 degrees over a day. Only sprinkled onto the wort, no starter, so may have taken longer than it should have to start.

Ferg, I dont understand, why would I drop it to 10 degrees?

Its still at 18 degrees.. should i take it up to 20 to try and kick start her? With only 20 grav points left would it throw off any bad flavours at this point at a higher temp? I have always been told to ferment cider as cool as possible.

I have never used pear juice before - I heard it has more unfermentable sugars than apple - would that mean a higher FG than just apple cider? Surely not 20 points though?

Cheers for your help gents.

Goatus,
My apologies for misreading the 10 thing...you meant 1.010...not ten degress...it was 3 am , i did have a baby i was trying to settle and i was fairdinkum knackered...
Most of yours flavours are developed in the first 72 hours ,so increasing the temp shouldn't give you any off flavours at this stage...
I'm not sure about pear juice...sorry...maybe Incider would care to anser that one ?
I also don't rack to secondary anymore...pain in the proverbial and increases your chance of contamination and oxidisation...in my oppinion lol
Good luck
Cheers
Ferg
ps...when i did my cider , it was 3 x 3 litres no name apple juice and a pkt of s-04...got it down to 1.014 but thats as far as it would go...

 

[wynnum1]

If you rack your taking a lot of the yeast away and that will slow down fermentation they say cider is slower to ferment then beer 7 days is not enough.

 

[O'Henry]

I'd be leaving it for a month and making a beer to drink in the meantime. Cider takes time. Just put two down on the weekend and am expecting one to take 2-3 months.

 

[Greg.L]

Pitching dry yeast into cider is not advised - you should always rehydrate at 35C for 20min if no instructions available. The result of pitching dry is what you got, stressed yeast. fermenting at 14C is good but because you started with stressed yeast at 18C then cooled it down, the yeast got even more stressed and just gave up. Try pitching again with properly rehydrated yeast, or aerating and adding yeast nutrient (DAP).
Cool ferments are good for cider but need to be properly managed.

Greg