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Group Barley Wine

Discussion in 'Central Coast Brewers' started by pmastello, 5/3/14.

 

  1. pmastello

    Well-Known Member

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    Posted 5/3/14
    Hi everyone, I thought I would start a thread for a Brew club activity of a group brew of a Barley wine.

    Basically, interested brewers state their interest in brewing a beer together. After a bit of discussion here on what the recipe will be - we will all get together one weekend at Toukley Homebrew shop and brew about 200L of a barley wine. We all split the cost between us all, so it should end up pretty cheap.


    After its brewed, we cube it up and everyone can take home 20L of wort to ferment at home. The one requirement is that we all use a different yeast.

    Then once its all fermented, everyone bottles it up and we swap around our beers. That way we get a case of different barley wines to age and taste over time.

    So - Who's in?
     
  2. mr_wibble

    Beer Odd

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    Posted 9/3/14
    Aye!

    An English Barley Wine?
    Recipe?
    Geeze, that means I need to find 20 litres of bottles - probably smaller ones.

    I don't have an "under the house" ... maybe I could bury it.

    -kt
     
  3. pmastello

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    Posted 9/3/14
    Nah, doesn't have to be English. We want to come up with a recipe that can lend itself to different yeasts - An American neutral yeast, a fruity english yeast, Belgian yeast, even a lager yeast! Hops will be the hardest choice here I think.
    Yeah, I'll need to find some smaller bottles too - haven't got many lying around, I'll have to start collecting.
     
  4. Goldenchild

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    Posted 10/3/14
    Count me in Pete. Wanted to do this one for a long time now.
    I have a friend who is also interested so how many of us would that make?
    I am thinkng of using wy9097 old ale which has a brett strain in it.
    I would also love to chuck some in the wine barrel but oxidisation could be a problem if its not full.
    Cheers Marc
     
  5. pmastello

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    Posted 11/3/14
    You could still Oak it with some chips or cubes if you wanted. How's your barrel saison going? Still got some left? I've found mine was too oaky initially and now is fading a bit.
    Good luck getting that Old ale yeast - its a private collection from a year ago. But if you can, awesome, it would be perfect for this. If you can't, they say Roselare is tolerant of upto 11%...

    So far we have with yeast preferences-
    Pete - Lager yeast
    Josh - ?
    Kt - ?
    Marc - Old Ale
    Marc's mate - ?

    Still got room for quite a few more people if there's interest!
     
  6. Goldenchild

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    Posted 11/3/14
    Hmm didnt think of oak chipping perhaps I will take 40L and oak half in a glass carboy. Thats if we don't have more takers.
    I was browsing craftbrewer lastnight and it says they still have some old ale from dec12 might need a few packets and a big starter but should still be viable. What size are we thinking anyway? 10%?


    That saison is tasting great! I am still getting to the bottom of the first keg. All reports are saying it has been getting better and better.
     
  7. Jaynus

    Active Member

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    Posted 11/3/14
    After an hour of sorting out this app I'm finally here! I'm "Marc's mate" but I go by the name of jay! I'm down for this brew and will get back tomorrow night with a yeast!
     
  8. brockerst

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    Posted 11/3/14
    Count me in!

    I'll have a think about yeast selection. I want to say saison, but am too scared to.

    Brock
     
  9. silvana

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    Posted 11/3/14
    I'm very interested.
    Looks like I might actually be able to make Aprils meeting too after living on the coast for a year.

    As for yeast I'll put my hand up for 100% Brett ferment with the strain pending further research

    Ben
     
  10. pmastello

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    Posted 11/3/14
    Now it looks like we've got enough people to make this happen. There's still room for more people to join up though!
    I am waiting to hear back from Duane on the size of his mash tun to work out exactly how much beer we can make and how many batches it will produce, I will report back when I hear. But even if we top out, you can still get involved, helping out with the brew day and with costs and you will get a share of the beer at the end. The more the merrier.

    So far we have -
    Pete - Lager
    Josh - ?
    Kt - ?
    Marc - Old Ale
    Jay - ?
    Brock - Saison (Don't be scared!)
    Ben - Brett

    Jeez, no one here likes standard Barley wine yeasts, do they?! Any volunteers for Scottish ale yeast or 1056? A Belgian yeast would be good too. Cool if you don't though, you can use a wheat beer yeast if you want!


    Does anyone have ideas for a recipe? Personally I've never brewed a barley wine before, so I'm open to suggestions. I was thinking around 10%
     
  11. Jaynus

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    Posted 12/3/14
    I'll have a stab at the Scottish ale yeast! 10% sounds good to me!
     
  12. Jaynus

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    Posted 13/3/14
    Scrap that! Safale US-05 for me!
     
  13. Jaynus

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    Posted 14/3/14
    Pete - Lager
    Josh - ?
    KT - ?
    Marc - Old Ale
    Jay - safale US-05
    Brock - Saison (Don't be scared!)
    Ben - Brett
     
  14. pmastello

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    Posted 14/3/14
    Dry yeast is probably a good idea, much easier to buy a few packs instead of growing up a huge starter.

    This is the recipe I have so far. Please have some input into this because I've never brewed a Barley wine before and I pretty much made this up. No hops yet, I was thinking of bittering to about 70-90 IBU. No idea of which hops to use. Aussie (Galaxy) or NZ hops? Or American or English.

    Group Barley Wine
    American Barley wine

    Type: All Grain
    Batch Size (fermenter): 180.00 l Boil Size: 200.00 l
    Boil Time: 120 min
    Brewhouse Efficiency: 60.00 % Est Mash Efficiency 60.0 %

    Est Original Gravity: 1.090 SG Est Final Gravity: 1.014 SG Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 10.0 %

    Ingredients
    Amt
    60.00 kg Pale Malt, Traditional Ale (Joe White) (5.9 EBC) 71.4 %
    15.00 kg Munich, Light (Joe White) (17.7 EBC) 17.9 %
    5.00 kg Crystal (Joe White) (141.8 EBC) 6.0 %
    1.00 kg Chocolate Malt (Joe White) (750.6 EBC) 1.2 %
    1.00 kg Crystal, Dark (Joe White) (216.7 EBC) 1.2 %
    2.00 kg Sugar, Table (Sucrose) (2.0 EBC) 2.4 %

    Total Grain Weight: 84.00 kg
    Mash Name: Single Infusion, Light Body, No Mash Out - Infusion 64C
     
  15. brockerst

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    Posted 14/3/14
    I've never brewed a barley wine either, and only ever tasted a couple but here's some input.

    How big is the mash tun?

    The trick with this recipe is going to be to get a good balance so that different yeasts with different attenuation rates don't mean too dry or too sweet an end product.

    I think the FG and the mash temp in this recipe is a bit low and may lead to relatively dry (for a barley wine) with some yeasts.

    Hopping will be a similar issue. Different yeasts will mean different FGs. 90 IBUs is probably too much with an FG of 1.014 but would work nice with an FG of 1.024.

    My vote is for American hops with a nice flavour hit. Aroma is probably a waste due to ageing.

    I'll use a Saison yeast. I plan to use the yeast cake of a small Saison rather than try and grow a huge starter.




    Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk
     
  16. stakka82

    Hoptimus Prime

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    Posted 15/3/14
    This is a great idea, good luck guys, if I lived closer I would be in!
     
  17. pmastello

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    Posted 17/3/14
    Yeah, you are right Brock, that FG is too low. That's just what Beer smith calculated, which is about 83% attenuation. I don't think we would actually get that low with a OG that high. You might if you use Belgian Saison yeast, but the rest of us will probably conk out somewhere in the 20's. But still, maybe knock the mash temp up to 66C then?

    I think a higher IBU is a good thing as IBU's will drop out over time. The best I can come up with is from Fundamentals of Beer and Hop Chemistry, 2/3 of the hop bitterness in wort has a half-life in excess of 5 years, and the remaining 1/3 as a half-life of 1 year. So, if you leave a beer for 1 year, it's IBUs will have decreased to 75% of its original value. For example, an 80 IBU beer will have 60 IBUs after 1 year.

    Plus this measure of 80->60 IBU is measured, rather than calculated. A lot of the IBU equations don't work so well for higher OG's or IBU's, so basically we are flying in the dark here. Maybe we can look at the IBU's on some aged commercial or Homebrewed examples. Or just pick a number. I'd vote for about 80 IBU.


    As for Mash Tun size, I had a chat to Duane on the weekend, he doesn't know exactly how much malt it will take, so maybe we can cap it 7 people (160L).
     
  18. joshuahardie

    Beer, so much more than a breakfast drink

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    Posted 17/3/14
    I'll be using a English ale yeast, like wlp007, 1098, or even the dry safale equivalent.

    I am happy with the Aussie hops, 90+ ibu.

    I have done some 10% stouts before so I'll go back through my records and see what I have done in the past.

    I don't know how big duanes mash tun is, but remember we can always add liquid base malt to get the gravity up
     
  19. mr_wibble

    Beer Odd

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    Posted 17/3/14
    Wyeast 3463 - Forbidden Fruit, tolerance 12%
     
  20. brockerst

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    Posted 17/3/14
    Ok so we might end up with a range of yeast attenuation rates of between 65% and 85%. Do we adjust for that somehow, eg finishing them off with a wine yeast? Or do we accept that this project is all about the variation between yeasts and let the cards fall where they may?

    We may need to increase OG if we want an average of 10% to perhaps 1.1.

    My first instinct is to go Australian hops too, but what would you use? I don't trust galaxy as a bitterer.

    Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk
     

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