Golden Syrup - Question

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Screwtop,

Just saw this. I think the yeasties need the sugar to be dissolved in water to allow them to ferment it.

I imagine the syrup would fall to the bottom and stick like golden syrup does.

Also as the break material and exhausted yeast fell to the bottom of the fermenter it would effectively cover the syrup therefore not allowing any convection currents to dissolve it to fermentable percentages.

cheers

Darren


Ahh Say, Ahh Say, it was a JOKE SON!
 
Just saw this. I think the yeasties need the sugar to be dissolved in water to allow them to ferment it.

Explains carbonation drops. :blink:

Darren surely the near boiling wort in the cube would dissolve the syrup in much the same manner sugar dissolves in a cup of tea/coffee?

Is this some more come in spinner?

Edit: I'm assuming that Tangent is doing no chill?

Warren -
 
Explains carbonation drops. :blink:

Darren surely the near boiling wort in the cube would dissolve the syrup in much the same manner sugar dissolves in a cup of tea/coffee?

Is this some more come in spinner?

Edit: I'm assuming that Tangent is doing no chill?

Warren -

If you examine bottle yeast under a microscope at 800 mag you will notice the ones fed on carbonation drops have broken teeth.
 
Yeast.jpg 2L of starter smelling a beaut.

I did do my 1st no-chill. Devolution of my brewing technique. I like the hop back aspect but the whole jerry melting and sagging didn't really give me much more faith in the process. However, i was planning on adding the entire contents of the T&L GS to the jerry and drop hot wort on it at speed. It certainly would have mixed up. I think Darren is just assuming that my brewing style is a little more subdued and careful.

Due to Adelaide temps and my lack of forward planning in the ice dept. this brew has been cooking at 24C for a few hours here and there between ice changes so I hope it's not too overpowering so I can taste the syrup (or not) for myself.

The original CPA must have white cane sugar added to the kettle because this stuff seems to add way too much colour and (delicious) aroma.

My original question still stands, does "partially inverted" sugar need to be inverted further by the boil to avoid the nasty side effect flavour? (from memory, invertase?) and if so, how long does it need to be boiled?
 
My answer is still I doubt it
 
Is the syrup boiled in production? If it is, then the invertase would be destroyed.


cheers

Darren

PS, Cant imagine them getting that thick without boiling
 
I assumed Tangent was worrying about the invertase produced by the yeast.
 
View attachment 11046 2L of starter smelling a beaut.

I did do my 1st no-chill. Devolution of my brewing technique. I like the hop back aspect but the whole jerry melting and sagging didn't really give me much more faith in the process. However, i was planning on adding the entire contents of the T&L GS to the jerry and drop hot wort on it at speed. It certainly would have mixed up. I think Darren is just assuming that my brewing style is a little more subdued and careful.

Due to Adelaide temps and my lack of forward planning in the ice dept. this brew has been cooking at 24C for a few hours here and there between ice changes so I hope it's not too overpowering so I can taste the syrup (or not) for myself.

The original CPA must have white cane sugar added to the kettle because this stuff seems to add way too much colour and (delicious) aroma.

My original question still stands, does "partially inverted" sugar need to be inverted further by the boil to avoid the nasty side effect flavour? (from memory, invertase?) and if so, how long does it need to be boiled?

Hi Tangent,
I have never used L and T syrup but I have used invert sugar that I do myself.
With my current CPA I did the required amount of sugar in 1 litre of water with a pinch of citric acid and boiled it separately for 25 mins or until it just started to colour.
I tipped the lot into the boil at the 30 min mark (60 min boil) and let it do its thing.
I tasted the wort from the cube today after I had let it sit at shed temps for two days ( kinda like a dyacetyl rest) and it is VEEEERY close to a CPA in colour and taste, even without carbonation. It was in the fridge during the hot day on Tuesday just gone.
I am going to try some in a JSOAA clone by boiling it a bit longer to caralemise the sugar a bit more and see how it goes as well.
Cheers
 
Kai was spot on with the yeast. 1.008FG

Colour isn't too dark which is what I was worried about.
Tastes good from the hydro - not much of a golden syrup taste or smell. just smells like the bottom of a warm stubbie of CPA :)
 
Explains carbonation drops. :blink:

Darren surely the near boiling wort in the cube would dissolve the syrup in much the same manner sugar dissolves in a cup of tea/coffee?

Is this some more come in spinner?

Edit: I'm assuming that Tangent is doing no chill?

Warren -


I though it was a joke!

Warren, no come in spinner. Just finished a cup of coffee then that sat around for half an hour or so. Plenty of undissolved sugar in the bottom although it was boiling and "stirred" :p

cheers

Darren

PS I still don't understand the invertase. I would have assumed it was an enzyme added to the the "sugar" to invert it without requiring acids and heat.
If it is an enzyme produced by the yeast, how will boiling help?

cheers

Darren
 
Tangent,

I think that the invertase used to invert the sugar at the refinery is isolated from yeast. Not your run-of-the-mill ordinary yeast either!
This source of invertase will most likely be denatured during syrup processing

I cant see up-regulation of invertase from your ferment yeast being a problem.

cheers

Darren
 
I read, talked netsearched and even e-mailed coopers for info.
Coopers replied that they use liquid sucrose (not inverted).
Invertingsucrose by adding citric acid splits sucrose into fructose ,and dextrose from my research.
I came to the lazy arsed conclusion that it was just easier to use Dextrose(a monohydrate) toA:add alchohol,and B:lighten the body in a cooperesque style without worrying about inversion.
It worked for my tastebuds.
 

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