Diacetyl Special Ale

[timmy]

1 kg Pale malt
3kg vienna malt
250g crystal
10 g hallertau 60 min
5g fuggles 60min
15 g cascade dry
10g cluster dry
safale S-04 yeast (no liquids here in the sticks)

mash at 68 degrees 90 min
boiled 90 mins
OG 1.045 FG 1.008
femented 5 days at 18 degrees
racked 2 days at 18 degrees then one week CC. Would be three weeks but I am thirsty.

result? The most buttery tasting brew yet. Not sur whether i like it yet. I'm guessing its the yeast.

Also my so called "cracked" grain was only about 40% cracked so my efficiency was farked. In the process of building a grain roller now.

 

[lou]

I only have bad things to say about s 04 yeast. All my brews bar one came out with very strong ester/diacetyl which didn't mellow. The only brew which came out well for me with this yeast was a stout. and i worked out that seeing it was brewing mid winter the fermenastion temp was around 15-16 C , which acording to dcl (manufacturer) is outside its proper brewing range. even still the stout though very drinkable was i would say a little bland- no suble yeast charectorisitcs at all which can be very pleasant in a stout.

my 2 cents,
do whatever you must to get a better yeast (mail order is available) particularly when going to all the trouble/fun of AG

lou

 

[dicko]

Hi Timmy

result? The most buttery tasting brew yet. Not sur whether i like it yet. I'm guessing its the yeast.

What other yeasts have you used?
Are you absolutely sure the taste is caused by the yeast?

Temp was correct at 18 deg c and from my experience with SO4 it works very well at that temperature with little diacetyl.

I would review procedures in regards to sanitising and careful transfer of beer during racking and cubing for cc.

I have used SO4 extensively for my brewing of ales and I have not had a problem and have only just recently gone into liquid yeasts to expand the possibilities.

I used a Nottingham dry yeast recently on an Aussie type ale and when I tasted it after 5 days in the primary it was high with diacetyl but I let it brew out and racked it and let it stand at room temp for a day and now in the the cube it tastes fine. I fermented it at 16 deg c.
I was pleased with the result of the Nottingham and that might be another option for you Timmy if you are in a remote area like myself.

PS
I like your grain mill.
Cheers

 

[Jovial_Monk]

leaving the beer in the primary fermenter would allow the yeast cake to clean up that diacetyl--don't be in a hurry to rack!

Did you aerate the fermenting beer well after pitching? sure way to generate diacetyl

Jovial Monk
PS I am not fond of S04, prefer the Danstar dried yeasts or liquid yeasts

 

[timmy]

JM,
racked at day five I think I never leave it in primary. I only aerate before pitching yeast.

Also sanitation is not an issue. I use abattoir strength foaming chlorinated detergent. The stuff is safe on stainless steel as well so it's good for kegs and the price is right too.

 

[Jovial_Monk]

Well, unless ambient temps dictate otherwise, try leaving your beers in primary for 2 weeks.

JM

 

[timmy]

Thanks JM I'll try that next time

Cheers

 

[Trent]

Hey guys
What does diacetyl taste like? The only time I have had unpleasant flavours in a beer was after pitching a new beer onto an entire primary yeast cake of a paler beer (never do that again!). I usually rack on day 3 or 4. Tony told me (on grumpys) he takes 100mL of primary yeast cake and pitches that into his next brew, then tips it back and forth between fermenters to aerate it. I was gonna try that next brew, but it sounds like it may be inviting diacetly, and it doesnt sound too tasty. I am reluctant to leave the brew on the primary cake for too long, for some reason, I have only left a few brews on primary for more than a week, and all of them turned out dead flat, even after 6 months in the bottle. That was before I started using liquids though, just a morgans ale yeast. Long post for such a simple question! Sorry
Trent

 

[sosman]

I've used S04 on quite a few ales with no problems. I typically leave mine in primary for 10 days and mostly don't secondary.

So where are the pics of your roller mill? I just finished making one (brewed with it just once) and the whole drama is acted out at:

brewiki: roller mill

 

[Jovial_Monk]

"What does diacetyl taste like? The only time I have had unpleasant flavours in a beer was after pitching a new beer onto an entire primary yeast cake of a paler beer (never do that again!). I usually rack on day 3 or 4. "
Diacetyl tastes a bit like butterscotch

Racking at day 3 or 4 is stupid--leave your beer in primary 2 weeks

To use cake, pitch increasingly strong and dark beers on the cake


Jovial Monk

 

[wedge]

Racking at day 3 or 4 is different not as a goods. But not stupid. I find with ales theres no need to primary for longer than a week. I do put in secondary for a week and then CC. Ofcourse lagers you would do much longer.

JM dont you usually drop you beers on day 2. How does this differ from racking on day three?

 

[Darren]

Once you have tasted diacetyl you will know what it tastes like. Saf 04 produces a lot of it. If you taste a beer made with this yeast in the first week it will be filled with diacetly.
I actually quite like diacetly (in small amounts). Could be described as adding a malty sweetness (flamesuit), butterscotch, honey-like, caramel icecream topping.. Overwhelming diacetyl in a beer is unpleasant though. It can really dominate the beer.

 

[Murray]

Racking at day 3 or 4 is different not as a goods. But not stupid. I find with ales theres no need to primary for longer than a week. I do put in secondary for a week and then CC. Ofcourse lagers you would do much longer.

JM dont you usually drop you beers on day 2. How does this differ from racking on day three?

Dropping at day 2 is silly anyway, IMHO. One-way ticket to butterscotch flavoured beer. I tried this with one batch and although the flavour was nearly gone after a few months in the bottle, it was unpleasant.

I have had very good results dropping a few hours after pitching though.