Cubes and storage

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skb

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I am reading the AHB forums and people are talking about using the 20lt cubes, eg the water cubes for storage.. Am I correct is understanding people are using the cubes to store wort, so post boil put in cube to store and not ferment ??

Is this right ? How long and what temp do you store at ? Also won't the wort go bad over time like extract

?? Just a little lost
 
Yep, it's all correct. An innovation by Aussie homebrewers to save water by not immediately chilling post-boil.

As long as you get the wort into the cube hot & exclude oxygen (ie. minimal head-space), it should keep indefinitely, since everything inside the cube is pasteurised. In practice, most folks ferment the contents of their cubes within days/weeks/months of wort-production, but there's anecdotal evidence of people successfully fermenting cubes of wort produced years previously.

There's lots of stuff to research on this. Google "No chill" & you'll get a swag of hits to keep you amused for a very, very long time......
 
Will have to research the no chill, I have always cooled as quickly as possible.. I like the sound of this.
 
yep search for no chill and ferment in cubes

its how they make (fwt) fresh wort
 
skb said:
I have always cooled as quickly as possible.. I like the sound of this.
Me too! I used to exclusively chill ASAP & straight into the FV, but since I researched it, the more I like it. It means that you can do the brewing when you CAN & ferment when you WANT.

Don't have the yeast starter up & running prior to brew-day? No problems. Starter is funky & not up to standards? No problem. Do another one & pitch when you're ready.

It also gives the flexibility to try different regimes of experimenting with different hops from the same batch of wort.

A constant supply of beer is at your fingertips.

Welcome to the vortex :D
 
If you store your wort in a plastic container it will oxidise through the walls, no way will it keep indefinitely. You are doing something that is difficult for food processors, the only preservative in there is the hops and the pH is quite high. There is going to be a chance of spoilage, increasing over time.
Personally I can't see why you would want to store wort for an extended time, what is the purpose? You should only brew as much beer as you can consume/give away. I know people want to experiment and do mashing even when they don't have a fermenter available, but to have wort sitting around long term is just asking for trouble (in my opinion).
 
Beating this drum again Greg?

Many many many people do it and produce fine beers, I don't get to brew every week anymore so the ability to punch out a triple batch and ferment at will is great for my situation, I do fill right to the brim and exclude all air. Cube hopping also allows me to have 3 different beers from the one wort also so that's an added bonus, combined with using different yeasts the 3 cubes can be significantly different.

How's that for a few good reasons?

I"should do" what suits my lifestyle, cubing suits so is right for me, I don't tell you that you "should" cube, please pay those that do the same courtesy.
 
Greg.L said:
If you store your wort in a plastic container it will oxidise through the walls, no way will it keep indefinitely.
Who said they were aiming to keep it indefinitely?
 
MartinOC said:
it should keep indefinitely, since everything inside the cube is pasteurised.

Bridges said:
Who said they were aiming to keep it indefinitely?
Here.

In the interests of fairness, there is the possibility of spoilage from spores that can survive the boil but in reality cube losses are rare (in my experience)

If you are up for the read of a pretty comprehensive thread that will **** ya head right up... have a read of THIS LINK.. be warned it's 24 pages long and does go round in a few circles here and there but at the end of that day it does have a lot of good information on associated risks and many peoples experiences with the method. etc..

:icon_cheers:
 
don't feed the trolls, or will get the lecture about glad wrap :)
 
http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/23742-ahb-wiki-the-no-chiller-method-using-a-cube/

Commercial Fresh wort kits are made similarly.

Do you have any actual experience of oxidised wort from cubes GregL? Because there's a lot of people with actual experience of storing wort for months, sometimes even years with no discernible issues.

I tend to ferment mine fairly soon after making but how I brew is my business. As mentioned - FWKs are made this way and they can and will stay fresh for some time. Just ask someone who makes and sells them.
 
Wow half way through... Did not realise I walked into a holy war !! I am going to give it a go next time I want to brew and fermenters are full ... Which is a lot if the time... for connivence and see how it goes and also taste back to back..
 
I'm not criticising the use of cubes, the main thrust of this thread was about storage. I don't have experience of using cubes but I have seen a few threads where the wort has started to ferment. "Rare" was the word used a few posts back - if a problem is rare, that isn't acceptable to me, though it depends on your definition of rare.

I do worry when people throw around the word "troll" just because they don't like their practises being criticised, but maybe I'm being oversensitive.

Regarding oxidation, oxygen is a very reactive substance. If oxygen can get into your wort it will start to oxidise. Long term storage in plastic is never a good idea.
 
I don't think you're a troll. I also know that plastic is permeable to oxygen - however real life experience from many, including commercial suppliers of FWKs suggest oxidation of wort in NC cubes is very, very slow and its real world effect on the wort in such circumstances is minimal.

Cubes fermenting without added yeast is due to cleanliness and sanitation, not oxidation.
 
Sorry wasn't trying to fire up a holy war. Just questioning semantics, most info I found on here when I started no chilling suggested no chillers generally were not looking for long term storage, as a technique it was more for the reasons of convenience and water savings outlined above by Martin. Missed the indefinitely part of his post though...
Major benefit for me was I didn't have to buy or make a chiller.
 
I presume fwk are produced under commercial sterile conditions, conditions unrealistic for home brewers. Do they have use-by dates? Personally I think your are better to store your beer as grain, though I appreciate there are reasons for short-term storage. ( I did say that in my first post) I really cannot see a reason for long term storage of wort.
 
Back on track guys, this isn't a slinging match about the pro's and cons of NC. Don't let this thread go down the way of so many others in the past! :beerbang:
 
Greg.L said:
I presume fwk are produced under commercial sterile conditions, conditions unrealistic for home brewers. Do they have use-by dates? Personally I think your are better to store your beer as grain, though I appreciate there are reasons for short-term storage. ( I did say that in my first post) I really cannot see a reason for long term storage of wort.
FWKs are hot wort run off into sanitised cubes. They do have use-by dates but I believe they are quite extensive. If Ross reads this, I'm sure he can chime in.

As said - I don't store long term (and I mostly NC into kegs now) but I know people do and I have no reason to tell them to stop. People with big systems, families and little brewing time, as Yob suggested, might brew large quantities and store some.

OP- make your own mind up but many people have been doing it for a really long time. If it suits your brewing, give it a bash.
 
I didn't realise there had been so many similar threads. Just don't ask me to go looking at long threads about nochill (shudders).

I also didn't realise going off-track was disapproved of on AHB.

The title of this thread does include the word storage, I don't see why my contribution upset people so much. Much better to just ignore me.
 
Telling people what they "should" and shouldn't do is a good way to get under the skin to begin with..

Rare to me is losing less than one batch on average over a 2 year period.
 
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