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fergi

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hi guys
i hope im not starting too many topics all at once but being new i need answers ,i have just put down my third brew in 3 weeks,this one is a coopers premium lager.i have added a malt,dextrose,corn syrup,hops dry pack which i had to boil for 3 minutes then add to my can of coopers lager with the kit yeast.i am now reading in these forums that you have to cold condition this type of beer,i havent as yet got any where to cold condition ,i pitched the yeast at 24 deg and the brew now 5 hours later is at 22 deg with a cool nite coming up it should get down to about 18 deg by morning,,,,,question have i wasted this brew by not being able to have it down to the temps that a lot of you guys do .shall i keep it or throw it out and start another type of brew.
cheers


fergi
 

pint of lager

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OK, to straighten a few things out.

A lager is brewed at 10-12 deg C using a proper lager yeast, last time I checked, the Coopers heritage lager has a lager yeast under the lid.

Part of the lager brewing process is cold conditioning after fermentation has finished, this is done at as close to zero that you can achieve with your gear.

Lager yeasts will work at higher temperatures, but will not give true lager charateristics.

The beer will be fine at the temp range you have currently, do not throw it out.

Next time, aim for lower temps. 20 is much more preferable to 24. For a true lager, you have to brew at 10-12, and follow up with cold conditioning.

Be warned, most kits that call themselves lager (pilsner and bocks included) only have ale yeasts under the lid. These must be brewed around 20-22 deg C.

Check with your homebrew supplier for what kits have lager yeasts.
 

action man

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if you want to get serious you can buy an old fridge and rip all the shelving out and set the thermostat to a suitable temp for lager yeasts to do their job (9-13 degrees).

as for CC you can get another fridge and turn it up as cold as you can without freezing the beer.

i know this sounds exxy, but you can get some cheap fridges at garage sales and second hand stores.
 

fergi

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just an update on my coopers lager,it has been down for 2 full days now,it started bubbling after about 4 hours,it has been very steady bubling through the air lock about 40 buubles per minute so it seems to be brewing nicley.the temp has been constant at 18 deg.slight froth on the top of the brew and can see a bit of sediment on bottom.how long approx will this take at this temp,i will probably leave it until hydro shows 1012 then give it another 2 or 3 days before i bottle it.it started out at 1042 sg.will it be okay to keep in secondry bottle at 18 deg or should it go in to a fridge for a couple of weeks




cheers
fergi
 

Hoops

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action man said:
if you want to get serious you can buy an old fridge and rip all the shelving out and set the thermostat to a suitable temp for lager yeasts to do their job (9-13 degrees).

as for CC you can get another fridge and turn it up as cold as you can without freezing the beer.

i know this sounds exxy, but you can get some cheap fridges at garage sales and second hand stores.
Or buy 1 fridge and put an electronic thermostat on it then you can dial up whatever temp you want :)
 

pint of lager

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When installing electronic controlled thermostats, make sure the sensor is close to the cold plate. A fridge thermostat relies on sampling from along its complete length, not just one spot in the fridge.

Fridges do not like quick on/off run times, more specifically, the compressor will burn out if it cycles on/off too rapidly. The compressor builds up pressure in the lines while running. This pressure stays there for some time, once the compressor stops running, and if it then is started back up with this pressure still present, the compressor is being started under very heavy load and may burn out.

As someone commented in another thread, you want to build some sort of hysteresis into the cycle time. That is, the temperature that it switches on the compressor, is a few degrees above the switch off point. And, that it will not cycle on as soon as the temp varies, for instance, the compressor has just cycled off, you open the door, temp rises rapidly and compressor is asked to switch back on while there is still back pressure in the lines.
 

pint of lager

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Back to your question about when it will be ready.

Wait a few days after it stops bubbling. Use your hydrometer. Wait 24 hours, take another hydrometer reading. If they are the same, it is ready for bottling. Wait another three days or so before bottling to allow the yeast to settle out. If all goes well, this will be about 10 days from when you made the brew up.
 

Hoops

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pint of lager said:
When installing electronic controlled thermostats, make sure the sensor is close to the cold plate. A fridge thermostat relies on sampling from along its complete length, not just one spot in the fridge.

Fridges do not like quick on/off run times, more specifically, the compressor will burn out if it cycles on/off too rapidly. The compressor builds up pressure in the lines while running. This pressure stays there for some time, once the compressor stops running, and if it then is started back up with this pressure still present, the compressor is being started under very heavy load and may burn out.

As someone commented in another thread, you want to build some sort of hysteresis into the cycle time. That is, the temperature that it switches on the compressor, is a few degrees above the switch off point. And, that it will not cycle on as soon as the temp varies, for instance, the compressor has just cycled off, you open the door, temp rises rapidly and compressor is asked to switch back on while there is still back pressure in the lines.
Sorry (thread hijack) :ph34r:
I have a Johnson thermostat and it is programmed so that after the compressor swithes off the compressor will not switch back on for several minutes. So if the powers goes off and back on the compressor will stay off for a couple of minutes before starting up again.

Hoops
 

pint of lager

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Kewel on the thermostat, an excellent choice. May your fridge give you many many years of trouble free service.

We better unhijack the thread so that fergi can sort out his first few brews.

Fergi, speaking of first few brews, do simple brews, read read read, then if anything is still unclear, ask more questions to clarify.

You will find there is a wealth of info already on the forum from past posts. Am not trying to deter your search for information, just trying to direct you to what is already there.
 

fergi

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ok thanks very much guys for the help,i appreciate it,i know it all seems so simple to you guys that have been doing this for a while but the new guys are always not so sure even by reading the instructions on the cans
cheers




fergi
 

pint of lager

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ok, some reading for you to do. Besides reading the current site go to the following.

John Palmer's excellent online book,

John Pamler's book

Go visit craftbrewer site



That will do for starters. You will be a complete brew genius after absorbing all of the above.

Agree totally on the crummy instructions on the tins, especially the bit about the ferment temps, some of the tins used to say 27-28 deg was fine.
 

fergi

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thanks pint,0 ill read that site
cheers
fergi
 
J

Jovial_Monk

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I also sort-of have my website up, www.jovialmonk.com.au, and there is a forum there if you need any advise out of business hours

Jovial Monk
 

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