Coopers Pale Ale

[fishard]

g'day all,

Thinking for my next brew I would like to put down a brew similar to coopers pale ale. Being only a kit and kilo bloke I was hoping you blokes could think back and go over some notes and maybe give us a few hints and suggestions on what to use.......kit
frementables
hops (taste & aroma)
yeast
I would also like to start to use some grains to get some freshness into my brews by trying steeping some grains and adding to the wort.

Its hard to know what goes with what when your new, so I hope you all help



Thanks Russ

 

[GMK]

i have made both the pale and the sparkling.
The sparkling is much better IMHO.

I used 2.5kg of light LME with the coopers can and the yeast that came with it.
Keep the temp around 20 - primary for 2 weeks - rack to secondary and cold condition for 4 weeks and bottle.
This beer definately gets better with age - at three months it is really good - when it is young it is slightly sweet.
But it is worth doing.

I did the pale and dry hopped it with Tassie Golding flowers as it lacked something - a bit bland even with 1.5kg of light LME.

Hope this helps.

 

[fishard]

Does help thanks GMK

Its hard to find kit recipes that go the extra and suggest hops etc

Cheers

 

[nonicman]

Fishard,
For hops Coopers use to use Pride of Ringwood, but not heavily (not sure you would want to use POR as an introduction to hops, as POR can have a harsh flavour if not fresh or if over used). For the yeast why not use the yeast from a bottle of Coopers Pale Ale, make up a starter a few days before you intend to brew (just search this forum for instructions.).

 

[fishard]

Jleske,
so far for taste I have been adding hops to the kit tin with some boiling water leave with the lid on the tin for 3-4 mins then add to the wort.

If i was to use POR this way what do you think 12g not over doing it??

 

[nonicman]

12g should be fine (you may not even notice this amount). I use to use a lot of POR, mainly for bittering and when I added more than 25grams, I use to get a "super VB" aftertaste to the beer, which is not pleasent.

 

[GMK]

Fishard - i would add the hops one of 2 ways -
Do a boil with 10 ltrs of water and the LME with 15 gms of POR for 20 mins.
Or
add the hops to the secondary via Dry Hopping.

Yeast
I have spoken to Paul Berger - he is Coopers Home brew manager ref the pale and sparkling kits.
The yeast they supply is as close as they can get to the original yeast they use in the fermenting. They are still having trouble drying out the yeast they use - need to iron out some more probs.
So - of you cultivate from the bottle it will be closer - but IMHO for the difference it is not worth it.

 

[jayse]

I used 2.5kg of light LME with the coopers can and the yeast that came with it.

I think this recipe would have to high a finishing gravity for a real 'clone' of pale.
Iam guessing 1.013 is about as low as you would get that, for a pale clone you would start by looking at the FG of 1.008 and start from there, given 4.9% alc work out the OG from that which would be 1.046.

Anyway i would swap some of the liquid malt in kens recipe for some sugar for a beer closer to a clone, what would really help is a swap another 500g of liquid malt also for a 750g pale malt and 250g wheat mash. mash at 65c.
15g -20g of POR boiled in the wort for 15mins.

anyway my addvice would be look at the 1.008 fg as the starting point and go from there, which would generally mean a recipe that is made up of nothing but liquid malt would not end up dry enough.
Go the sugar, they use it in there and so should you if you want to get close to reproducing it. I'd use sugar for about 8% of the fermentables which would be around 350g.

Ferment no higher than 18c and there you have it.

I find cloning recipes its best to start with the beer itself, with this beer a stand out factor and starting point will be the FG. In the beer itself theres is some 40ebc crystal malt but using a coopers pale ale can you would not add any crystal malts as they will be in the can. The only grains you would use in a recipe based around the can is some pale malt and wheat which would need mashing.

Hope that gives you some more ideas fishard.
Happy brewing
Jayse

 

[GMK]

Jayse is right - i used the 2.5kg of LME with the Sparkling Ale - it is a higher ALC %.

With the Pale - i only used 1.5kg of LME.

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[jayse]

Thats not what i was talking about GMK, (the difference between the OG for the sparkling and the pale), i was questioning wether either of those brews with 100% liquid malt extract would attenuate enough. Given the desired apparant attenuation to reproduce a coopers pale or sparkling would be around 82% i think with all liquid malt you would be pushing to get 75% at most. You could do it with all malt but you would have to do your own mash to make a very fermentable wort. I would go the otherway and be happy to use sugar for up to 10% and use a traditional ale malt base, or some barret burstons pale is similar to what i remember the old amc was like to go closer to using a malt similar to what coopers are using, i like the ale malt idea best with just a smidge of crystal and around 20ibu.
The barret burston 'pale' malt has that 'tasteless' mega lager taste! :blink:

Iam gunna make a similar beer soon, but use 1007 german ale and finish with 15g of cascade at 15mins. Will have the same malt bill and bitter with POR.
The aim will be to get down to 1.008. I think i have seen people quote fg's of around 1.015 with there coopers pale kit can plus 1.5kg can liquid malt brews.
What i was getting at is it needs to be lower.

jayse

 

[Kai]

I agree with jayse, the FG won't be anywhere near low enough using solely liquid malt extract. Doesn't the commercial pale ale finish at 1.003?

 

[fishard]

Thanks for all the imput,

you have all given me some more ideas and have kept me thinking :huh:

I will keep reading and let you know how it goes

cheers

 

[fishard]

ok I have a little conflict in the way I am reading things,


when you talk about 2.5kg LME does this include the kit?

any way here is what I am think of doing

Coopers pale ale kit 1.7kg
Pale LME 1kg
Dextrose .5kg
DME .25kg
Maltodextrin .25kg

I hear what jayse is saying about FG..........what would you expect the FG to get down to using this? On the calculator at the brewcraft site its around 1013. I know this is a guide but was wondering if you blokes would expect lower than this?

I hope you can understand my confusion>>>.... :huh:

please feel free to ad your mods

Cheers-Russ

 

[GMK]

OK - the 2.5kg was in addition to the can contents as was for the sparkiling ale kit - as the og is higher.

I would drop the DME above.
I also dont think u need the Maltodextrin\corn syrup - it can add a taint (IMHO)
Boil the LME and dextrose in a saucepan for 20 mins with some hops 20gms of POR.

Hope this helps

 

[Bobby]

i agree with gmk. drop the lme and malotdextrin. although you could probably get away without boiling the hops.

 

[fishard]

Ok thanks for clearing that up Ken.........I thought that was the case, and I take onboard what you say about the DME and maltodextrin!

Bobby I take it you mean drop the DME not the LME???????

 

[Bobby]

no the lme.
i have made it with the lme, it turned out quite nice but abit to much body. which supports what the guys have said.

 

[sluggerdog]

Would anyone suggest using SAFale over the yeast that comes with this kit?

Which would be better? SAFale or The kit Yeast?

Thanx

 

[Bobby]

the kit yeast is fine for this beer. i think it may be different to the coopers kit yeast supllied with the other coopers kits.

 

[sluggerdog]

Oops! Had a packet of safale sitting here so I used that insead...

Doesn't Matter, Thanks though...