Co2 Reg Gauge Reading Plate Buckled.

[Truman42]

Just went to hook up my first ever keg (Man thats so much easier than bottling, why didnt you guys tell me about this before )

Turned on the gas and noticed the backing part of the pressure gauge that has the PSI reading on it is buckled and the needle was getting stuck on it as it rubbed past it.

I managed to flick the gauge to let the needle keep climbing, but I have no idea how this happened. My guess is the cold gas may have done it.

Is it easy enough to pull this gauge apart and straighten the face plate or whatever you call it? Or am I up for a new co2 regulator?

 

[Cocko]

What brand of gauge is it?

 

[Truman42]

I know what your going to say...

Its a keg King regulator which I brought secondhand from KK. But it was fine when I did.

I decided that as its no good as it is anyway I pulled the gauge off and managed to remove the cover and straighten the face plate. Seems to work okay now..But quick question..

When I turn on the gas and the needle rises to my set pressure of 42 PSI, before I disconnect the QD do I pull the release valve on the Regulator to release pressure in the line and is this only releasing pressure in the line and not in the keg as well?

 

[glenwal]

When I turn on the gas and the needle rises to my set pressure of 42 PSI, before I disconnect the QD do I pull the release valve on the Regulator to release pressure in the line and is this only releasing pressure in the line and not in the keg as well?

There's no need to pull the release before disconnecting the QD.

 

[Rowy]

Hard to say.....................

 

[Truman42]

There's no need to pull the release before disconnecting the QD.

Ok thanks for that. I wasn't sure if I had to release pressure in the line before I took the QD off.

 

[Truman42]

Hard to say.....................

Hard to say that I brought a cheap crappy Chinese regulator and should of not been a tight arse and spent more money on a better one?

No its not...

 

[Cocko]

Nah, not what I was getting at, at all.....

I would assume, not a regulator builder or much knowledge in their construction, but the actual dial plate never comes in contact with gas? Anyone? Surely the whole dial is not under pressure?

So, if I am assuming correctly above, you are trying to work out how a thin metal dial face got bent?

Transport and/or care during use.

1.2c assuming cents.

 

[Truman42]

Ok this gauge is doing weird things.

When I disconnect the QD the needle doesnt quite drop back to zero then slowly climbs back up to almost 60 PSI then the valve starts to stutter. I thought it was just gas in the line so I pulled the release and the needle drops back down but not all the way to zero. Then I release the valve and it climbs again back up to 60 PSI and the valve stutters again. This kept going on for awhile until I think I finally got all of the gas out of the line.

Is that normal for the gauge to do this?

 

[glenwal]

Ok this gauge is doing weird things.

When I disconnect the QD the needle doesnt quite drop back to zero then slowly climbs back up to almost 60 PSI then the valve starts to stutter. I thought it was just gas in the line so I pulled the release and the needle drops back down but not all the way to zero. Then I release the valve and it climbs again back up to 60 PSI and the valve stutters again. This kept going on for awhile until I think I finally got all of the gas out of the line.

Is that normal for the gauge to do this?

Is the gas bottle still on? Do you have anything else connected to it (manafold, splitter, etc...) or is it just a single QD?

 

[Hippy]

Don't stress about the buckled gauge. Even the more expensive reg gauges do it. I have a BOC dual reg with a buckled plate and it still reads ok. They're not much thicker than foil when you look at them , so as long as the needle can get past the buckle and you can get a reading you should be ok.

 

[Truman42]

Is the gas bottle still on? Do you have anything else connected to it (manafold, splitter, etc...) or is it just a single QD?

No gas bottle is off ( it's actually a fire ext mounted upside down) and the only thing connected to the regulator is the QD.
That's why I think it had to be back pressure in the line but im also using a non return valve so not sure what's going on with this regulator.

@ hippy. The dial was touching the plate causing it to stick but it's ok now since I've fixed it.

 

[glenwal]

No gas bottle is off ( it's actually a fire ext mounted upside down) and the only thing connected to the regulator is the QD.
That's why I think it had to be back pressure in the line but im also using a non return valve so not sure what's going on with this regulator.

Must be a slow leak backwards through the non return valve then.

 

[Cocko]

So we are evolving in issue here?

Your original post is now irrelevant and you have some spooked out reg yeah?

Not being smart, just to be clear...

 

[wombil]

With the gas bottle turned off,use a screwdriver or similar and push the little tit in the QD in and that will release the gas in the line.All gauges should be zero then.

 

[wombil]

By the way,what are you running at 42 P.S.I.

 

[MHB]

Between the bottle valve and the seat seal in the regulator there is a bit of gas at bottle pressure, you have a very slow leak in your seat seal, gas is slowly leaking into the low pressure side of your regulator (the part connected to the line and QD), when it reaches a given pressure (usually around 400kPa for CO2 regs) the internal safety relief vents and the pressure drops, this repeats causing the valve to chatter.
Eventually you use up the stored high pressure gas between the valve and the seal seat and all is quiet. Usually only happens on cheap regs at somewhat below the normal bottle pressure, you might notice the same thing happening when the bottle is nearly empty.
The chattering isnt good for the reg to prevent it from happening, turn off the bottle, disconnect from the keg, pull the relief on the reg until no more gas is venting, ideally relieve the pressure on the diaphragm by un-screwing the pressure setting knob
Mark

 

[Truman42]

So we are evolving in issue here?

Your original post is now irrelevant and you have some spooked out reg yeah?

Not being smart, just to be clear...

Yeh mate I fixed the bent plate and the needle now moves full travel without getting stuck on the plate. But now having other issues with this reg. Should have known not to buy a cheapy.


@Wombil..Im force carbing, filling the keg to 41 PSI each day over a few days.

@MHB..One thing I did notice is that if I pulled the relief valve while the QD was still connected to the keg I didn't have this problem once I removed the QD. But if I removed the QD first then pulled the relief valve once I let go the gauge would climb again and the valve chatter. I had to keep pulling the relief valve about 6 times before it finally settled down.

Another question..Should the needle on the gauge always rest back at zero once everything is disconnected or can some residual gas keep it just off zero? Because it sits around 2-5 PSI. Could this mean the gauge is out of calibration?

 

[MHB]

Either way you are still relieving the pressure between the bottle and the seat, if you do it while still connected to the keg, you are also venting the gas you just put into the keg which is sort of not what you put the gas in there for.
Inside the gauge there is a very fine hollow tube formed in a coil, you have bent the coil.
If you bend the need up so it clears the little post and wind it backwards with your finger you can sometimes get it to return to the zero position and sometimes you stuff it completely bend the needle back down, dont go too far backwards so the needle is touching the post or you will have an invisible dead pressure and it will screw up your readings.
Or you can just deduct the error from your reading, or replace the gauge personally it isnt a reg I would be investing a lot of time or money in, think about doing an upgrade as soon as you can.
Mark

 

[Truman42]

Thanks Mark. It cost me $40 from KK second hand and I knew it was a cheapy but didnt realise this cheap. The pressure setting knob feels very stiff and cheap when you screw it either way.
Might call it a right off and buy a new one.

 

[Truman42]

Ok I've brought a new gauge and for now it's working okay.

Just a question on these regs, how go you read what gas level is in the keg?
If I connect up the QD the reg still says 0. If I open the valve it climbs to 40 PSI. But isn't this just what I've set the reg at anyway and therefore how much gas is going into the beer?

 

[Wolfy]

When I turn off the CO2 at the bottle, I find that the regulator gauge stabalizes (after a bit) at the pressure that (I assume) the keg is at.
(Which is useful to know when force carbonating the keg or individual PET bottles).

Edit, it's too late now (and I didn't understand all the technical mumbo earlier in the thread) but when you were having the 'over pressure' problem, are you sure that keg was not overcarbonated, perhaps from carbonating it to a set pressure when it was cold and then letting it warm up?

 

[Florian]

Turned on the gas and noticed the backing part of the pressure gauge that has the PSI reading on it is buckled and the needle was getting stuck on it as it rubbed past it.

I have two micromatic regs which have a buckled backing part and needle, both from when the bottles fell over onto the reg.

You can actually open the gauge window with a small screw driver or similar (at least the micromatic ones, there is a little groove to lift the window off) and carefully bend the needle and plate back into shape.

No need to replace the gauge.

 

[glenwal]

Ok I've brought a new gauge and for now it's working okay.

Just a question on these regs, how go you read what gas level is in the keg?
If I connect up the QD the reg still says 0. If I open the valve it climbs to 40 PSI. But isn't this just what I've set the reg at anyway and therefore how much gas is going into the beer?

You can't really read the pressure in the keg because your non return valve stops the pressure returning from the keg to the gauge. If you open the gas bottle and the gauge jumps to 40PSI, then thats what your reg is set to.

If you have force carbed the keg and want to drop it down to a known level (can't think why else you are disconnecting the QD and reconnecting) you'll need to burb the kegs and then hook up the gas again.

 

[Truman42]

@ Wolfy....No I had the keg sitting in the fridge at 4C and havent moved it from there.

@ Florian...I straightened the backing plate by pulling the gauge apart but the needle wouldnt zero. A new gauge was only $10 at KK.

@Glen W.....Thats exactly what Im doing force carbing by adding CO2 until I reach 40 PSI on day one then disconnecting the gas. Doing the same on day 2 then a couple of days later I need to check what the gas level is in my keg. If its below 14 PSI I need to add more CO2 until it gets to 40 PSI again.

(Im disconnecting the gas because the keg is in a normal fridge)

But if I burp the keg then hook the gas back up again wont it show 40 PSI as thats what my reg is set at? How can I check and see when my keg has reached 14 PSI in the keg

 

[Wolfy]

I'm new at this kegging thing myself, but if you're force-carbonating, why not use the 'Ross Method'?

Basically you set the reg to 40PSI and shake the **** through the keg for 60sec, turn off the CO2 at the bottle and continue to shake while watching the pressure gauge drop, continue as required until the gauge drop remains at the pressure you want (14PSI).
It takes a tiny bit of manual effort to shake the keg, but I found it very quick/simple/easy and takes only a couple of mins (not days) to have the keg carbonated and ready to drink - someone here has even provided a photo/video description of how to do it.

 

[glenwal]

@Glen W.....Thats exactly what Im doing force carbing by adding CO2 until I reach 40 PSI on day one then disconnecting the gas. Doing the same on day 2 then a couple of days later I need to check what the gas level is in my keg. If its below 14 PSI I need to add more CO2 until it gets to 40 PSI again.

(Im disconnecting the gas because the keg is in a normal fridge)

But if I burp the keg then hook the gas back up again wont it show 40 PSI as thats what my reg is set at? How can I check and see when my keg has reached 14 PSI in the keg

Thats a fairly odd method for force carbing isn't it? If your taking a week (2 days + a coupld of days) then just hook up the keg to the gas and leave it outside the fridge and let it carb up?

What you can do though is
1) Turn on the gas (before connecting the QD to the keg)
2) Turn the gas off again (the reg should still show the pressure that is in the line between the reg and the QD - this pressure needs to be greater than what you expect in your keg
3) Connect the QD to the keg

The pressure in the line will then equalise with whats in the keg (the higher pressure in the line can flow that direction through the NRV to the keg), and the small amount of gas in the line won't effect the pressure you have in your keg

4) The reading on the reg should be what is in your keg.



edit: Or as wolfy suggests, the ross method will get you carbed and drinking in no time with no fuss.

 

[Truman42]

Thanks guys will give that a go.