Bottled Biab Losing Flavour And Not Ageing Well

[Markbeer]

Hi

I brewed and bottled my first AG BIAB. I mashed for 90 mins at 68 degrees. I fermented using a Safale US-05 American Ale Yeast. I bottled it after 2 weeks in the primary and it tasted nice and malty straight out of the fermenter.

I have been opening bottles every few days to try :drinks: however, after almost 2 weeks, it has started to become dry and lose the malty flavour which I loved. What could it be? Is it the yeast type I used?

The mistakes I made was I forgot Whirfloc and didn't use a secondary. I can't see these making the flavour reduce in the bottle.

Anybody experienced this?


Thanks.

Mark

 

[manticle]

Beer changes as it conditions.

Stop trying it and judging it after 'nearly' two weeks and let the flavours integrate.

 

[Bribie G]

It very much depends on the recipe. A lot of modern ales taste best young - especially the UK bitter and best bitter styles - they are meant to be shipped out to the pubs in casks and drunk within a couple of weeks. When bottled they can change into a totally different tasting beer after a month or so. For example many brewers of ales for competitions let their bottles condition for a couple of weeks then whack them in a very cold fridge and keep them at around zero degrees until the competition day - I've got a couple in the fridge right now for July in "suspended animation".

Some styles really do benefit from a long bottling period but this idea of "bottle and do not drink for a couple of months" is a hangover from the days when most home brewers used kits or malt extract and it often does take a long time for them to become drinkable and lose most of the "twang".

In the case of all grain beers (BIAB, 3 vessel, whatever) they are often best when they are young.

 

[manticle]

Bribie, while I agree with you that a lot of well looked after AG beers are great fresh and may lose some character with too much age, less than a fortnight is still too little to make a full judgement.

Admittedly half my cases are often gone before they've hit full carbonation and I'm happy with the flavours, but flavour changes and develops. Comparing a 10 day old beer with how it tasted in the fermenter is not going to give an accurate story.

Certainly too early to suggest 'it's not ageing well'.

 

[matho]

When you pour your next glass get a spoon and stir it to knock some carbonation out of it. Overcarbonation can cause the beer to seem thin and watery.

Give that a go

Cheers matho

 

[Ironsides]

Its likely that the reason it is getting dryer is because the priming sugar is fermenting out. This slight sweetness probably helps to carry the maltyness through. I find that the ferment starts to taste really thin when the SG drops below 1020. Give it a month in the bottle and see what its like.

If its still no good, you change the next recipe to include grains that give residual sweetness/maltyness.

Well thats my thoughts anyway.

 

[Markbeer]

Hi

Thanks for the responses, I will point out that it is only the second all grain I have done and the first was an ESB Ale Fresh Wort Kit. Had the same issue, beer kept getting drier and less flavoursome with age. Converseley, all my extract brews seem to get better with age.

So should I be mashing with more Cara and Crystal malt? Would Vienna malt lead to a maltier taste as well?

And using a yeast with lower attenuation as well?

Thanks

 

[mikk]

Markbeer, i've been finding the same thing with my all grain beers in comparison to previously using kits. Previously, i'd make a kit ale and it wouldn't taste it's best for a few months. Now, with all-grain, it's taste in the bottle is best (by far) as soon as it's carbed adequately. Using a keg system has proved to maintain the peak flavour for far longer (when force carbed and kept refrigerated), and this seems true even for big hearty 6% ales that i would've thought would need some age to them to get to their peak. I don't believe sanitation to be the issue, as the beers aren't off or bad, just not as good aged as they are young. Whirlfloc or Brewbrite is always used, most break and trub is removed, using a secondary fermenter or cold conditioning the secondary doesn't seem to help much.
No-chill method is being used. Whilst ageing some stouts, porters and big belgians and ipa's has been beneficial, these so far have been the exception to my statements above. Has anyone else found similar?

 

[sm0902]

I keg my AG and have enough left over for a few bottles. I'm generally not impressed with the bottled beer. It seems to pick up a metallic like flavour - a flavour I've also tasted in commercial craft beer.

Wouldn't say my bottled beers are thin/dry .... just a metallic flavour.

Recently I made a few beers with London ESB Yeast (1968) and the bottled beers have been perfect.

Edit: I mostly use American Ale Yeast II - 1272 and make APA and Blonde Ales.

 

[felten]

I find the opposite to that, my beers may be drinkable after carbing but they're definitely better after being stored in the fridge for a few months. I just finished off a bottle of a 3% alc standard bitter that had been bottled since January and it was the best it's ever been, I just wish I had saved more.

having said that, I don't drink very often, that's why mine stick around for that long.

 

[goomboogo]

Hi

Thanks for the responses, I will point out that it is only the second all grain I have done and the first was an ESB Ale Fresh Wort Kit. Had the same issue, beer kept getting drier and less flavoursome with age. Converseley, all my extract brews seem to get better with age.

So should I be mashing with more Cara and Crystal malt? Would Vienna malt lead to a maltier taste as well?

And using a yeast with lower attenuation as well?

Thanks

What was the starting and finishing gravities of the two beers you've made. What was the fermenting temperature? I know US05 fermented the second but what yeast was used on the fresh wort kit?

 

[cdbrown]

Could it be that you are getting used to the beer by drinking it every few days and your palate has adjusted?

I probably wouldn't use US-05 for a malty beer, english yeasts are better for highlighting malt flavour.

 

[Markbeer]

What was the starting and finishing gravities of the two beers you've made. What was the fermenting temperature? I know US05 fermented the second but what yeast was used on the fresh wort kit?

Hi

I didn't write them down unfortunately. They were both Safale US-05. I read in Dave Miller's brewing book that generally All Grain tastes better the younger it is (generally I emphasise). The solution most touted is to store all beers once carbed in the fridge, as this slows the yeast and allows a more full malt profile to come through. Some yeasts apparently, over time, strip out levels of malt flavour.

I guess I am used to cans and extract, where I have had ones in the bottle for 7 years and tasted great, although still nowhere near as good as the couple of all grains I have done.

sm0902 a metallic taste in the bottle sounds maybe like a sanitation issue. I had this only once with a Lager I think picked up from a fermenter. I use alkaline caustic for my bottles (crazy I know) but never had an off-taste due to infection other than the lager.

 

[mikk]

I've also heard it said that all grain beers are best had young, but i really don't know why this would be the case.

Maybe those more knowledgeable than myself would know. Markbeer, did Dave Millers book give any possible reasoning for this?

Also, Bribie G's comments are on the money.

Mikk

 

[Markbeer]

I've also heard it said that all grain beers are best had young, but i really don't know why this would be the case.

Maybe those more knowledgeable than myself would know. Markbeer, did Dave Millers book give any possible reasoning for this?

Also, Bribie G's comments are on the money.

Mikk

He just said that "All-grain beers are not like wine. They don't necessarily age well" went on to say that is a reason why they pasteurize them as the yeast will cease to work and autolyse.

 

[J.T]

In the case of all grain beers (BIAB, 3 vessel, whatever) they are often best when they are young.

Old thread...

I reckon I'm discovering this myself. I've had a few kegged AG brews lately that I think have deteriorated with age. Including DSGA, LFPA, Double Chocolate Stout and lately a Sculpin type IPA.
Stout aside, they've all lost a lot of hop aroma and flavour to an extent that I'm, well...a bit disheartened!

 

[Charst]

Over what period of time are we talking? and how much? what makes you think its the BIAB. I have a fat yak fresh in a pub and its delicious, have a old bottle from my local bottlo and its flavourless, no hop aroma at all. they dont BIAB

 

[hoppy2B]

I was reading up on yeast yesterday and wine. Esters and things break down and re-assimilate over time with a resultant change in flavour and aroma of wine as it ages. Same thing happens with beer no doubt. Perhaps dry hopping after the beer has aged may help.
No idea really. :unsure: Most beer isn't made for aging and should be drunk within a reasonable time frame. Finding a good combination of malt, hops and yeast that ages nicely is the only real solution.

 

[mfeighan]

i dont bottle but i look at a keg as 1 big bottle. i picked up what i thought was a dusty empty keg in the shed, realised it was full, chilled and carbed. Tasted amazing, little less hop character but still delish. Im pretty sure it was smurto's land lord must have sat in the shed for 10-11 months temp abused and all.

 

[Kranky]

JT dry hopped beers should generally be consumed fresh. The oils released from dry hopping are volatile and do not last a long time. If you have an old keg of dry hopped beer and you want to freshen it up just re-dry hop it.