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Best way to add choc and coffee to stout

Discussion in 'General Brewing Techniques' started by Diddlez, 4/5/18.

 

  1. Diddlez

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    Posted 4/5/18
    Hey guys,

    Looking at making an oatmeal stout in the style of founders breakfast.

    I'm just going to make a fairly generic version first before I try to stick as close to possible to the actual recipe.

    Just wanted to know what are the common methods of getting chocolate / cocoa / cacao and coffee into the brew.

    The safest bet that I've read seems to be adding about cacao nibs and coffee beans after primary fermentation. This is what I'm going to try on my.first batch and I guess I'll adjust after tasting.

    I've read that adding choc / cocoa and coffee to boil or even steeping too long in warm can cause bitterness, so variables like that are what I want to try to avoid on my.first stout attempt.
     
  2. golfandbrew

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    Posted 22/5/18
  3. contrarian

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    Posted 22/5/18
    In my experience adding to the fermenter works well but don’t add loose. The other option is to steep both in vodka for a week or two and strain the liquid off. It will add plenty of the flavour without all the particle matter.
     
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  4. Dark Maiden

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    Posted 23/5/18
    I agree with contrarian. You could make a tincture using vodka and soak the beans. Then strain the solids out and pour the vodka/cocoa concoction in. I did the same thing with vanilla beans recently, and a mate who is teaching me everything regularly uses this tincture method to great results.
     
  5. pirateagenda

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    Posted 23/5/18
    unground coffee beans cold steeped in the fermenter add aroma and flavour without colour
     
  6. pnorkle

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    Posted 23/5/18
    Maybe, but given it's a stout, adding colour probably isn't an issue.
     
  7. ///

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    Posted 23/5/18
    Don't listen to the complicated vodka soak folks, add 300mls of expresso per 50l straoght into the keg and fill. try varying amounts of filtered coffee. Cold press is a nightmare, once did 50kg worth into a stout and went everywhere and cleaned up for days

    More a concern is chocolate, have mucked around with it, just go an no-oil extract.
     
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  8. contrarian

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    Posted 23/5/18
    Not sure what’s complicated about throwing some coffee beans and cacao nibs in some vodka for a weeks or so and then straining them? It would take longer to make the espresso!
     
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  9. Aarkhana

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    Posted 23/5/18
    Had great results with a choc vanilla porter. Made a tincture with vanilla beans, cacao and vodka. Cacao nibs in the fermenter for stuck in the tap so probably would have been better in a bag. Added cold brew to some small bottles (10ml) - they tasted amazing.
     
  10. Coalminer

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    Posted 23/5/18
    With cacao nibs I crush them and then put them in the oven at 150c on paper towels for 15 mins
    Lots of oils get soaked up in the paper.
    Then soak these with vanilla beans in vodka.
    Usually toast the oats in the oven as well
     
  11. ///

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    Posted 24/5/18
    Apart from espresso or filtered coffee taking about 10mins to make and cold press over night, why wait a week. Better to put nibs in the WP and mash from experience.
     
  12. MHB

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    Posted 24/5/18
    Many home brew shops sell flavours for making vodka taste better (wink).
    I have found some of the Liquor flavours very useful, especially the Prestige range, they are all oil free and taste very authentic. Prestige Cream De Coca is spectacular, reminds me a lot of flavour in Youngs Double Chocolate, I find using Nibs or Coco powder always harm the head on the beer.
    They also do a bunch of fruit flavours as well as all the common spirit flavours.
    Add about half what you think you will need, then taste before adding more.
    Mark
     
  13. Darc

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    Posted 19/6/18
    Coarsely ground coffee chucked in a hop sock for dry hopping not an option?
     
  14. Diddlez

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    Posted 27/6/18
    I bottled this stout about a month ago,

    Used 100 grams of cacao nibs and coffee beans ground up fine like an espresso and put it in a container covered in vodka for about 4 days. The grounds soaked up all the vodka so I was left with what looked like a massive cacao / coffee " puck ". I added all of this into a muslin bag straight into the fermenter for about 5 days.

    Massive cacao sweetness. U couldn't get any of the coffee taste or aroma so I'll add maybe triple the coffee next time. Might even try putting 50 odd grams of beans at the end of boil and maybe some cold brewed straight into the fermenter at bottling.
     
  15. TimT

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    Posted 28/6/18
    I've made a coffee milk porter over several years, it's a pretty successful brew. Cold press is the way to go.

    I use about 6 handfuls* of fresh coffee beans for about 10 litres of porter. (I did a quick measurement just then - six handfuls is about 60 grams, 10 grams per handful). I steep it in water in the fridge during primary fermentation, and then I strain out the coffee grounds before using that same water for bulk priming.

    This year I've pushed up the alcohol content of the porter a bit with a bit of sugar and some more base malt so the ABV is around 8.4%. I should also have amended my recipe to add a handful of coffee beans during the boil as I think this would have brought out some more coffee flavours, but I forgot. I'll do that next time.

    Choice of coffee bean is pretty important. If the beans are too old they'll have lost a lot of flavour and aroma. Some roasted coffee flavours are a bit too weird for beer too, IMO - some of the more spicy flavours don't pair well with the beer or hops. A good espresso bean is probably your best bet.

    I'm not sure about cocoa. I like the sound of adding cacao nibs to the fermenter. My only experience with a chocolate stout has been bad. The cocoa didn't dissolve properly in the malt and I think a lot of it went out with the sediment. As with cooking, your best bet when using cocoa is, I suspect, to mix it up to a paste beforehand: add a little wort at a time to the cocoa, stirring well to ensure a smooth paste. Keep on adding gradually to mix it in evenly. (The alternative, just dumping it in the brew pot at the start of the boil, results in cocoa lumps that never dissolve.)

    *Super scientific measurement!
     
    Last edited: 28/6/18
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  16. buckerooni

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    Posted 28/6/18
    interesting, so the cold steeped coffee liquid is added via the priming solution only? or is some of the liquid/beans dumped into the fermenter at some stage?
     
  17. TimT

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    Posted 28/6/18
    Buckerooni, right, I found the most convenient way is to add it as the priming solution.
     

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