Berliner Weisse

[TerritoryBrew]

Hey guys and girls,

Thinking about brewing my first Berliner Weiss in the next week. I have formulated this recipe and would like your thoughts on it. I am not sure whether to use the Kolsch yeast or wheat beer yeast that I have. I think Wyeast 3068. The Lactobacillus will be added just after primary.

Also is the infusion temp of about 71c too high, I want it to be light bodied like I have read it should be...

Thanks,

TB

Brew Type: All Grain
Style: Berliner Weiss
Batch Size: 20.00 L
Boil Volume: 22.89 L
Boil Time: 60 min

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
1.30 kg Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 52.00 %
1.20 kg Wheat Malt, Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 48.00 %
6.00 gm Tettnang [4.50 %] (60 min) (First Wort Hop) Hops 4.2 IBU
1 Pkgs Kolsch Yeast (Wyeast Labs #2565) Yeast-Ale
1 Pkgs Lactobacillus Delbrueckii (Wyeast Labs #4335) [Add to Secondary] Yeast-Ale

Beer Profile Estimated Original Gravity: 1.030 SG (1.028-1.032 SG)
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.007 SG (1.003-1.006 SG)
Estimated Color: 2.5 SRM (2.0-3.0 SRM) Color
Bitterness: 4.2 IBU (3.0-8.0 IBU)
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 2.91 % (2.80-3.80 %)

Mash Profile Name: Single Infusion, Light Body
Sparge Temperature: 75.6 C
Sparge Water: 14.70 L


Mash In Add 6.52 L of water at 71.9 C 65.6 C 75 min
Mash Out Add 4.17 L of water at 93.5 C 75.6 C 10 min

 

[Fourstar]

Well i have just done an experimental 'Berliner', have put in 9.8% acidulated malt to drop the pH dramatically and to test the waters to see if the lactic acid which occurs naturally in the grain adds any tartness at all. Only a small 15L batch so if it does fail, all i lost was 2.5KG of grain.

Smelt delicious during the mash with the mash hopping. I was planning on doing a sour mash or a no boil but my conscience got the better of me.

your recipe looks the goods. If you want to do things traditionally, a sour mash would be a nice option.

my recipe below:

BeerSmith Recipe Printout - www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Berliner Weisse
Style: Berliner Weiss
TYPE: All Grain


Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 15.00 L
Boil Size: 18.62 L
Estimated OG: 1.036 SG
Estimated Color: 2.7 SRM
Estimated IBU: 3.3 IBU


Ingredients:
------------

1.50 kg Pilsner, Malt Craft Export (Joe White) 58.8 %
0.80 kg Wheat Malt, Malt Craft (Joe White) 31.4 %
0.25 kg Acidulated (Weyermann) 9.8 %
20.00 gm Tettnang [4.50%] (Mash Hop) 3.3 IBU


Cheers! :icon_cheers:

 

[kook]

your recipe looks the goods. If you want to do things traditionally, a sour mash would be a nice option.

Which brewer used a sour mash? I thought the standard method was simply to mash and ferment?

I cheated with my berliner - used the WYeast blend. I'm pretty happy with the results so far, but even more impressed with what the blend did to a darker beer I used it on. I think the additional Brett helps to add more acidity and complexity along with the lacto.

Personally I'd just keep it to 50/50 Pils/Wheat. Acidulated doesn't do a lot in my experience, it really is intended just for reducing the mash pH.

 

[T.D.]

Calling Les!

 

[Duff]

Calling Les!

Les has a receipe somewhere on AHB. I'm sure there has been a thread on it.

Edit: I think this is it.

 

[Fourstar]

Which brewer used a sour mash? I thought the standard method was simply to mash and ferment?

sorry yes wrong choice of words, I reads somewhere that 'traditionally' allot of American home brewers do it with a sour mash similarly to brewing a Kentucky common

But as you have said a simple mash then ferment is traditionally how this beer is made.

 

[TerritoryBrew]

sorry yes wrong choice of words, I reads somewhere that 'traditionally' allot of American home brewers do it with a sour mash similarly to brewing a Kentucky common

But as you have said a simple mash then ferment is traditionally how this beer is made.

Thanks all...

I had a read of Les' post re: sour mashing. I would have to say that sounds freakin awesome, but I think this time around I will make it with a wheat yeast and dose it p in secondary with the Lacto.

Not being a biologist or the like, can I culture Lacto on slants???

Cheers.

 

[Stuster]

Also is the infusion temp of about 71c too high, I want it to be light bodied like I have read it should be...

I've nothing to add on the lacto on slants question (but interested to see how people are doing it). Just to go back to this point, 71C is far too high, too high for any beer really. For this kind of beer, I'd have though more like 64C.

 

[goomboogo]

Stuster, I'm not sure but I think TerritoryBrew meant that he was going to use 71c as his strike water temperature. Depending on the variables of batch size etc, he would probably be looking at the 64-65 mark after dough-in. I may be wrong but I think this is what TerritoryBrew was getting at.

 

[TerritoryBrew]

Stuster, I'm not sure but I think TerritoryBrew meant that he was going to use 71c as his strike water temperature. Depending on the variables of batch size etc, he would probably be looking at the 64-65 mark after dough-in. I may be wrong but I think this is what TerritoryBrew was getting at.

Sorry about that. I had a look at my recipe, stuffed up, It will be a mash temp of 65. Sorry

 

[Stuster]

Think you're right, goomboogo (what is that name anyway! :lol: ). And his mash temp of 65 should be fine. Must read posts more carefully.

 

[Weizguy]

Sorry about just spotting this thread.

A couple of points need to be made.

Yes, you can culture lacto on slants;
No, I would not use the W3068 for a Berliner weisse (I used W1007, but the Kolsch should be OK);
Have some lactic acid on stand-by to top up any lack of acidity, as lactobacillus is quite slow.

I'll find my recipe and post it to the database. I thought it was there, but may have dropped off?

Don't mention the war

 

[Weizguy]

The Berliner Weisse recipe is in the recipe database here.

FWIW, it was well-enjoyed and it's the beer Kook took back to WA for PistolPatch.
What can I say? I love to share good beer more than I enjoy a drink. I hope to get a report on the flavour after 2 years in the bottle. They say that Berliner's mature for up to three years. We'll see. No pressure, Pat. :lol:

Les

 

[Fourstar]

Have some lactic acid on stand-by to top up any lack of acidity, as lactobacillus is quite slow.

Know anywhere i can quickly get my hands on some food-grade Lactic Acid? If mine doesnt get that lactic bite i might go this avenue.

I could go for a drive to G&G but by the time i get a chance to do that i could pitch a lactic culture, bottle and be drinking it sooner! (work 9-5 and study on Saturdays)

Pharmacy maybe or a specialist foodstore?

 

[Weizguy]

Know anywhere i can quickly get my hands on some food-grade Lactic Acid? If mine doesnt get that lactic bite i might go this avenue.

I could go for a drive to G&G but by the time i get a chance to do that i could pitch a lactic culture, bottle and be drinking it sooner! (work 9-5 and study on Saturdays)

Pharmacy maybe or a specialist foodstore?

A pharmacy should be able to help. Lactic acid, I believe I have mentioned b4, is one of the ingredients in wart remover, FWIW.
Or you could run a sour mash with about 500g malted grain and a handful of malted, uncrushed grain...

 

[brendanos]

As Les mentioned you'd be better off with the Koelsch yeast, or any neutral ale strain.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but you would be better off pitching the lacto at the same time as (or before) the ale strain, as lacto is inhibited by alcohol, and "just after primary" would be too late.

 

[Fourstar]

A pharmacy should be able to help. Lactic acid, I believe I have mentioned b4, is one of the ingredients in wart remover, FWIW.
Or you could run a sour mash with about 500g malted grain and a handful of malted, uncrushed grain...

well ive already brewed and pitched to primary on the weekend. the acidulated may assist in the tartness, but if its lacking ill bite the bullet and take the risk with lactic acid. Even though its the cheats way out, many Berliners have won awards going the unnatural method of souring it.

Doesnt wart remover have Salicylic Acid? i'd prefer to be purcahsing lactic acid 80% 20%H20 or something than wort remover with 20% lactic acid and 80% indegestible chemicals.

 

[ohitsbrad]

I'll second brendanos with pitching the lactobacillus at least with the ale strain if not before. Since we used the blend we couldn't control this, and the lactic sourness isn't huge. Although the blend has the brett too which is developing over time. And the wheaty grainy flavours come through more because of it.

I see you've got a 60 minute hop addition. Short boils seem to be common for a berliner weisse. Not sure why apart from a long boil being unnecessary. Maybe someone else can comment. We did a 15 minute boil only and first wort hopped.

Les, glad to hear that it might age well. Was hoping it would last til at least this summer.