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A Bucket Of Evil

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Tony M

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Last night I pulled a glass from my new keg of pale ale. Great hop nose, very nice
in the mouth, but swallow and the most evil harsh taste right at the back of my tongue.
It is sort of bitter but no more hop bitterness than there should be. I find it difficult
to describe but if anything I thought of the stink when an electrical circuit has burnt
out. It is a new sort of "kitchen sink" brew. You make it then pour it down the kitchen sink.
I have never experienced this before and was wondering if anyone knows wot i done.
 

GMK

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you might have to post the recipee an dhow long it brewed, temp, racked etc...
Include the gravity readings...

So the taste was just bitter, or off, or burnt.
It sounds to me like tanins maybe - dont know about the grain bill etc.

If it is tanins - then they will disapate - CC for a month and then tate test again...
 

Batz

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That's an infection Tony , I had that myself , you can smell the beer in the glass , smells the same yukky smell as the yukky taste :ph34r:

I did another brew from the same fermenter and had it again , I threw the fermenter away , bit harsh but I was very pissed off

Hope all goes well next time

Don't forget to remove the tap from the fermenter and clean the thread/tap
 

Tony M

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I just had a thought----Burnt electrics-----cooking bakelite---bakelite is a trade name for phenolic resins---therefore phenols. Where do those come from?

GMK, the recipe was pretty straightforward
3.6K ale malt
0.25K crystal
handful of chook wheat
22gm. n/brewer +30gm fuggles for 1hr.
15gm. fuggles 15min
15gm. fuggle 1min bitterness should be about 34.
wyeast 1098
went from .043 to .008
 

GMK

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Tony

What was the temp of the mash.
What temp was fermentation..

The 1098 yeast should not have produced alot of phenols unless the fermenter temp got really high...
 

warrenlw63

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Tony,

All signs say an infection. But a point with Wy. 1098. I've found it to be very un-flocculant. Whenever I've used it, it's taken forever for the beer to clear. Maybe it's a bit of yeast bite/suspended yeast?

However the sensation you're describing sounds like an infection (odd bitterness/phenols). I've had them before the bitterness sort of reminds you of eating a very un-ripe grape or stone-fruit. Always comes through on the finish with a bit of a metallic edge. I'd just set the beer aside for a couple of weeks. It's either going to get better or a heck of a lot worse. You'll know one way or another then.

Happens to all of us at one time or another - :(
Warren
 

Tony M

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GMK,
Should have included those figures.
I mashed at 65 for 25min,
then 65 to 70 over 3 min.
then held at 70 for 1/2hr.
pitched at 26C then
1st. ferment 24C for 7 days (brew day was pretty warm)
2nd. ferment 22C for 7 days
CC at 5C for two weeks
The only thing I did differently this time was to nappisan my buckets for a few days to strip the brown crud that had built up, but I felt I gave them a pretty good rinse
.........................
Warren,
Your taste descriptions sound pretty accurate.
 

Batz

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I am sure you would have rinsed enough , that's pritty straight forward , I still say infection
Do you remove the tap and clean the thread?
 

Linz

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And disassembled the tap and cleaned it too.
First infection I got was from the crud that built up inside the ridge that holds the tap together. It was very slight at first, but the next brew got worse.
I have thrown all the "twist" type taps and now only use snap taps as they completely come apart for proper cleaning. They also reassemble without leaking afterwards.
 
J

Jovial_Monk

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The twist type taps also come apart. Turn the handle so it is horizontal with the tap held in the same position it is in screwed into the fermenter, grasp the handle with a pair of pliers and holding the body of the tap in the other hand and holding the downspout of the tap simply pull the tap apart: it is basically one barrel inside the other. Rinse both parts of the tap with hot water then plunk them in a bucket of sanitiser solution.

The thread in the tap hole should be cleaned thouroughly with a used soft toothbrush dipped in sanitising solution.

The snap taps are not the most robust in construction.

Whatever tap you use do remember that the tap and tap hole/treads are the source of 95% of the infections you will experience


Jovial Monk
 

Hoops

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I had some brew buddies that had infections from their taps, so when I bought a new fermenter I never put a hole in it for the tap - just rack with sterile hose.
 

warrenlw63

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That's probably the main reason I switched to glass carboys.

Plastic fermenters are OK but I've always had issues with taps. They either leak, harbour shit or just tempt you to constantly take samples of your beer out of paranoia. It's also a bit of a buzz (the first few times) watching the fermentation take place in glass.

Siphoning is a bit of a pain. However it's like everything. Do it often enough and it always becomes easier. Glass has more longevity. Doesn't get invisible scratches that hide infections. I just soak them with Napisan after racking, rinse them out the next day and leave them filled with bleach and water for the next batch. I'm slowly discovering that napisan has to be the homebrewers best friend. Cleans off virtually any crud that builds up in fermenters or kegs. Could this mean that trub is closely related to baby shit?? :lol:

One point Tony, you said that you pitched your yeast at 26c?? It's probably a bit on the high side. You're asking for excess diacetyl and solventy flavours in your beer. Should never really pitch above 20 maybe 22c absolute tops.

Warren -
 

PostModern

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Plastic taps cost $1.48 from Bunnings. I recently stocked up and tossed all my old taps. The 3 new taps I bought cost as much as 1 HBS bought tap. But hey, for $1.48, you could replace them every second brew and not worry about disassembling, and sanitising etc... just one less thing to do on brew day.
 
J

Jovial_Monk

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26C is a bit high for pitching, 23-25C is better, then slowly cool fermenter to ale or lager ferment temps. You will not get any off flavors that way, see the Dr Clayton Cone posts on the HBD for more info.

Pitching a bit warm helps the yeast more quickly get acclimatised to your wort and begin budding

Jovial Monk
 

sosman

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warrenlw63 said:
I'm slowly discovering that napisan has to be the homebrewers best friend. Cleans off virtually any crud that builds up in fermenters or kegs.
There is at least one thing better than napisan - the active ingredient of napisan, sodium percarbonate. IIRC napisan contains this at about 25%.

The only downside to raw sodium percarbonate is that you might need to buy 25kg of the stuff. But hey, the SWMBO will find a million and one uses for it in the laundry.
 

warrenlw63

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You got me interested Sosman,

Where does one aquire raw Sodium Precarbonate?

Warren -
 

PostModern

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No Frills Nappy Cleaner is the best source.
It's about 34% iirc.

According to http://www.heraproject.com/ExecutiveSummary.cfm?ID=84 more than 25% is "dangerous" for your eyes.

Accidental exposure of the eyes to dry products which contain sodium percarbonate or to solutions of household cleaning products which contain sodium percarbonate could result in eye irritation. Only if the sodium percarbonate concentration in the product or the solution is very high (> 25%) irreversible damage to the eye could occur if the product is not immediately washed out, which would normally be the case.
So don't go rubbing your eyes with it!

I don't think you can buy 100% sodium percarbonate anyway. As far as I recall, the little pebbles in nappy cleaners are basically Sodium Percarbonate coated in an innert carrier, allowing it to be stored and shipped safely and without degrading. Once dissolved in water, it releases it's active ingredient - Hydrogen peroxide and other (environmentally harmless) by-products.

Just use the No Frills stuff. It's cheap enough not to bother chasing pure sources, I reckon.

Apologies for taking this thread further off-topic.
 

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