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How Long To Mash


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14 replies to this topic

#1 agraham

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Posted 14 September 2005 - 01:58 PM

How long should i be mashing?

I usually mash for 90 mins but have read that you can do it for longer.

Are there any pro's or con's for doing a longer mash?

Will i get better efficiency if doing a longer mash?

Will i also get better efficiency if i use a higher water to grain ratio, say 4L:1kg as opposed to 2.5l:1kg of grain?

Thanks,

Andrew

#2 warrenlw63

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Posted 14 September 2005 - 02:10 PM

G'day Andrew.

I just use 3 lts per kg and mash for 90 mins. Works well enough for me.

Can't see any real benefits in mashing longer. Your day is going to be long enough as it is. Higher L/G ratios may cause bigger temp losses in your mash over time too because of a reduction in thermal mass.

Warren -

#3 Doc

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Posted 14 September 2005 - 02:10 PM

Mash time depends on a number of variables such as your grist compliation and crush, temperature and liquour ratio.
In my experience a great crush with aussie malts at around 3.0 litres/kg @66degC is converted in 60 mins.
Having said that I always mash for 90 mins at around 66-68degC with a liquor/grist raito of 3.2-3.4 litres/kg.

Beers,
Doc

#4 Gerard_M

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Posted 14 September 2005 - 02:22 PM

Do an Iodine test after 45mins & you might get a shock!

#5 Trough Lolly

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Posted 14 September 2005 - 03:30 PM

As Gerard is hinting, most well modified base malts convert in the first half hour to 45 mins of the mash, but I always err on the side of caution and mash for 90mins.

I've read of overnight mashes but I don't see a need to do it and once the mash is on, I'm psyched up and ready to boil the hell out of something, rather than go to bed!!

TL

#6 tangent

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Posted 15 September 2005 - 12:09 AM

Try and clear the damage before the missus gets home...

#7 Boots

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Posted 15 September 2005 - 08:53 AM

Something I've always wondered about longer mashes is, do you get more malt flavour because the grain is steeping for longer?

What I'm asking is, will a 45 minute mash give less malt flavour than a 90 minute mash because the grains are in contact with the liquid for less?

Or does the malt flavour pretty much leach out in the very early stages?

#8 Doc

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Posted 15 September 2005 - 04:01 PM

Something I've always wondered about longer mashes is, do you get more malt flavour because the grain is steeping for longer?

What I'm asking is, will a 45 minute mash give less malt flavour than a 90 minute mash because the grains are in contact with the liquid for less?

Or does the malt flavour pretty much leach out in the very early stages?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Where are Chiller and Wes when you need them ? :lol:

Doc

#9 peas_and_corn

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 01:07 AM

I've been reading the overnight mash thread and this one too now and I've been perplexed by all this. Since I've only really ever heard of 90 min mashes the idea of an overnight one intrigues me, and I have asked myself the same question as Boots- does the time affect the flavour in any way, or is the attraction of overnight mashing just for people with little time?

#10 Jazzafish

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 09:55 AM

I was listening to the brewing network when 15min mashes were mentioned!!! However, from this stage the brewer did mention they cycle sparged for some time after that. And they were using modified malts.

Basically it is my understanding that the main purpose of the mash is to convert the starches to fermentables. From there we use water to carry these fermentables away from the grain.

To see if the starches are converted, as gerrard touched on, you can do a conversion check. From the palmer book:

The brewer can use iodine (or iodophor) to check a sample of the wort to see whether the starches have been completely converted to sugars. As you may remember from high school chemistry, iodine causes starch to turn black. The mash enzymes should convert all of the starches, resulting in no color change when a couple drops of iodine are added to a sample of the wort. (The wort sample should not have any grain particles in it.) The iodine will only add a slight tan or reddish color as opposed to the flash of heavy black color if starch is present. Worts high in dextrins will yield a strong reddish color when iodine is added.


Having said all that, I have only mashed for an hour and slow sparged for around an hour to an hour and a half. Results are efficiencies between 70 to 80%. I guess we are all over protective for a quaity drop of brew!

Cheers,
Jarrad
edit: typo

Edited by Jazzafish, 26 March 2006 - 09:56 AM.


#11 Les the Weizguy

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 10:09 AM

I'm thinking that an overnight mash would cool significantly and allow the beta-amylase enzymes to work their magic. You would get a thinnish beer, which would attenuate well. That's good, if it's what you're after, but useless if you initially mashed high to get a beer with a fuller body.

I admit to doing an overnight mash in the past, but I can't even recall the results.

Now, the only time I do an overnighter is for an acid rest (phytic acid), which likes an initial 40C and to be left for a couple of hours or longer. Probably useless for anything other than a Berliner weisse, or maybe a soured porter.

The problem occurs, as with the "No-chill" technique of wort cooling: The wort spends a long time at temperatures under 80C. And, yes the "No-chill" beer is in a sealed environment, unlike the mashed wort. And yes, the mash is to be boiled, so both can be a gamble in terms of the microflora lottery. Unless you are a food technology scientist or a lucky gambler, you can only let experience (of yourself and others) guide you.

Hmm, maybe if U put hops in the overnight mash, with their antimicrobial properties...?

Seth out :P

#12 JasonY

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 11:42 AM

Generally I mash for between 60-90 mins. I have done a few overnight/all day mashes when time has been short. Mash duration in this instance was about 10hours. I noticed no great change in the beer in terms of maltiness or body however I did mash higher and include a bit more xtal to compensate for any extra enzyme activity. It works fine but I would only bother doing it if you cant get a normal brew done.

#13 Tony

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Posted 28 March 2006 - 08:32 PM

I did read that mashes under 66 deg will produce more atenuative and less malt flavord beers while above this will produce a maltier beer.

Malt seems to dextrinise at the highter temps and its the dextrins that produce the flavours, thats why u get a malty beer when u decoction mash, cause you boile it to produce melanoidens ect.

i usually mash from 66 to 68 deg in 2 to 2.5 l/KG for 60 to 90 min depending on how much time i have and how much adjunct there is in the brew. but i like malty beers.

cheers

#14 Darren

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Posted 28 March 2006 - 08:44 PM

Something I've always wondered about longer mashes is, do you get more malt flavour because the grain is steeping for longer?

What I'm asking is, will a 45 minute mash give less malt flavour than a 90 minute mash because the grains are in contact with the liquid for less?

Or does the malt flavour pretty much leach out in the very early stages?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>



Boots,
I presume you have a refractometer?
Check you gravity after 15-20 minutes. My experience is that is pretty well done by then (having said that I usually mash for an hour). Longer mashes leach undesirables.

cheers
darren

#15 Trough Lolly

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Posted 28 March 2006 - 09:06 PM

I've been reading the overnight mash thread and this one too now and I've been perplexed by all this. Since I've only really ever heard of 90 min mashes the idea of an overnight one intrigues me, and I have asked myself the same question as Boots- does the time affect the flavour in any way, or is the attraction of overnight mashing just for people with little time?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


It's fun reading what you wrote on an earlier thread, and then completely contradict it!! :blink: :P

I did an overnight mash last weekend - my first. It went well and the only reason I did it was because I was on my own at home with my two boys and didn't have enough time to do a full brew, and stop them from destroying the house!! So, yes, I had little time...But I tell you this much, finishing the brewday at 11:30am the following morning was an absolute bonus!! :chug:

IMHO the overnight mash tastes maltier and according to promash, I gained quite a few points of efficiency. Now that may have not actually been more sugars, I might have extracted more unfermentables after leaving the grains in the mashtun for 8+ hours - I dunno, it's a German Pils that's bubbling away in the lager fridge right now...

On a standard brewday I stick to 90mins at 66C.

Cheers,
TL