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Style Of The Week 27/9/06 -oktoberfest/marzen


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#1 Stuster

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 10:12 AM

To celebrate the Munich Oktoberfest I thought we'd look at style 3B of the BJCP guidelines, Oktoberfest/Marzen. Of course it's not October yet but the Germans are so efficient that most of Oktoberfest is held in September. This kind of beer is not even the most commonly served at the Munich Oktoberfest anymore either, article here. Wikipedia article here.

However, let's have a look at this amber lager. What grains do you use? What hops and when? Which yeast? How long do you condition it for and how cold? Has anybody made a kit-based Oktoberfest? Which commercial beers can you recommend? Have you been to the Munich Oktoberfest and have some interesting tales to tell? This thread has some useful info and links to get you going.

Any suggestions for future Hop/Style of the week will be gratefully received.

Let's talk Oktoberfest. :beer: :chug: :party:

3B. Oktoberfest/Mrzen

Aroma: Rich German malt aroma (of Vienna and/or Munich malt). A light to moderate toasted malt aroma is often present. Clean lager aroma with no fruity esters or diacetyl. No hop aroma. Caramel aroma is inappropriate.

Appearance: Dark gold to deep orange-red color. Bright clarity, with solid foam stand.

Flavor: Initial malty sweetness, but finish is moderately dry. Distinctive and complex maltiness often includes a toasted aspect. Hop bitterness is moderate, and noble hop flavor is low to none. Balance is toward malt, though the finish is not sweet. Noticeable caramel or roasted flavors are inappropriate. Clean lager character with no diacetyl or fruity esters

Mouthfeel: Medium body, with a creamy texture and medium carbonation. Smooth. Fully fermented, without a cloying finish.

Overall Impression: Smooth, clean, and rather rich, with a depth of malt character. This is one of the classic malty styles, with a maltiness that is often described as soft, complex, and elegant but never cloying.

History: Origin is credited to Gabriel Sedlmayr, based on an adaptation of the Vienna style developed by Anton Dreher around 1840, shortly after lager yeast was first isolated. Typically brewed in the spring, signaling the end of the traditional brewing season and stored in cold caves or cellars during the warm summer months. Served in autumn amidst traditional celebrations.

Comments: Domestic German versions tend to be golden, like a strong Helles. Export German versions are typically orange-amber in color, and have a distinctive toasty malt character. German beer tax law limits the OG of the style at 14P since it is a vollbier, although American versions can be stronger. "Fest" type beers are special occasion beers that are usually stronger than their everyday counterparts.

Ingredients: Grist varies, although German Vienna malt is often the backbone of the grain bill, with some Munich malt, Pils malt, and possibly some crystal malt. All malt should derive from the finest quality two-row barley. Continental hops, especially noble varieties, are most authentic. Somewhat alkaline water (up to 300 PPM), with significant carbonate content is welcome. A decoction mash can help develop the rich malt profile.
Vital Statistics:
OG FG IBUs SRM ABV
1.050 - 1.056 1.012 - 1.016 20 - 28 7 - 14 4.8 - 5.7%

Commercial Examples: Paulaner Oktoberfest, Hacker-Pschorr Original Oktoberfest, Ayinger Oktoberfest-Mrzen, Hofbru Oktoberfest, Spaten Oktoberfest, Eggenberger Mrzen, Goose Island Oktoberfest, Capital Oktoberfest, Gordon Biersch Mrzen, Samuel Adams Oktoberfest (a bit unusual in its late hopping)



#2 jayse

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 11:16 AM

I'll add a one liner or two :lol: weyermann munich II is the ducks guts, don't need to use as much of it as you would in a dunkel or anything but just enough of it to get more than a idea is good.

Theres some old recipes floating around in such books as classic beer style series were they have recipes with pils malts and crystal malt I think those are way of the mark personally. Stick to the vienna and munich malts and don't overdo the crystal malt if you use any at all. Hops? anything noble and only 1/2g per litre for flavour and no aroma is enough for style but you can go more no worries. At 1/2g per litre for flavour it will only be just enough to be perceived behind the malt if your going 1.055-1.060 and using weyerman munich II in a reasonble portion. I don't mind them with just a touch extra hops coming through myself.
Bitterness is pretty straight forward around 28IBU (depending on gravity) of the same hop. Yeast? i don't have a real fave really so what ever blows your skirt up and you know will do a good job, theres plenty of choices as far as a good lager yeast goes.

Happy lateseptemberfest
Jayse

#3 Dr Gonzo

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 01:07 PM

I worked hard all winter to get up a stock of oktoberfest for october.
Like all other beer stockpiles iv'e attempted to create, this one was hit hard early.
Fortunately i still have 2 cubes of the best conditioning in the frige.
These babies have been lagering for at least 3 months now at 1C.
Spose i better get em into kegs pretty soon.

Weyermann Munich & Vienna malts are definately the go. No crystal.
A decoction helps bring out the best in them.
I like a Tettnanger bittering addition
Tettnanger/Saaz flavor addition
& Saaz aroma addition
Bavarian Lager & Bohemian Lager yeasts are both good.
I like to start fermentation at 8C with a big starter & never let it get over 10C.

#4 Trough Lolly

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 02:28 PM

Ditto to the last couple of posts....this brew is one of my faves!

I've a keg of Oktoberfest that's been lagering at 1C for some time now and it's screaming out to be tapped!!! They never last long at my place.

As for hops, I tend to stick with decent dose (approx. 30 IBU) of Hallertau MF to bitter and that's that. I've deviated from the norm by doing one recently with 80g of pale choc malt and Wyeast 2000 Budvar to ferment it with and it's not bad - just a slight twang that tasted ok to me. Pils malt and crystal is not the go for these beers - as Jayse mentioned, Munich II is the grain to use.

A decent healthy starter of Wyeast 2308 makes a pretty decent Okkie, IMHO...Enjoy, it's a great beer.

TL

#5 Ash in Perth

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 02:28 PM

This is the next beer I'm brewing.

2.5kg Munich II
1.75kg Vienna
0.5kg melanoiden
0.25kg pilsner (to get rid of it)
0.20kg caramalt

30g perle at 60 min
20g crystal at 15 min
20g saphir at 5 min (or flame out?)

about 27IBU, 1.055.

Ferment cold with WL833 (german bock)

CC for 1 month after 1 day diacetyl rest at 15DegC

#6 Ross

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 02:43 PM

One of my favourite brews...

This one is fermenting away happily - Trying something different from my usual recipe & brewing a Ray Mills inspired recipe...

Oktoberfest/Marzen
Type: All Grain
Date: 19/09/2006
Batch Size: 26.00 L
Boil Size: 34.00 L
Boil Time: 90 min
Brewhouse Efficiency: 85.0

Ingredients

Amount Item Type % or IBU
3.15 kg Vienna Malt (6.9 EBC) Grain 59.0 %
1.10 kg Munich II (dark) (23.0 EBC) Grain 20.6 %
0.55 kg Wheat Malt, (dark) (17.0 EBC) Grain 10.3 %
0.27 kg Caramunich I (90.0 EBC) Grain 5.1 %
0.27 kg Caramunich Malt III (150.0 EBC) Grain 5.1 %
15.00 gm Northern Brewer [9.30%] (80 min) Hops 14.2 IBU
25.00 gm Tettnang [4.10%] (80 min) Hops 10.5 IBU
15.00 gm Hallertauer Mittelfrueh [4.10%] (15 min) Hops 2.7 IBU
25.00 gm Tettnang [4.50%] (1 min) Hops 0.5 IBU
1.00 tsp Table Salt (Boil 90.0 min) Misc
2.00 gm Epsom Salt (MgSO4) (Boil 90.0 min) Misc
3.00 gm Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) (Mash 90.0 min) Misc
5.00 gm Calcium Carbonate (Boil 80.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs SafLager German Lager (DCL Yeast #S-189) Yeast-Lager

Est Original Gravity: 1.052 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.014 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 5.0 %
Bitterness: 27.9
Est Color: 22.7 EBC

Cheers Ross

#7 THE DRUNK ARAB

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 03:05 PM

One of my favourite styles to brew and drink. I have one lagering atm as well, tis this season and all that bollocks!

I have used the following yeasts in the Oktoberfest brews I have made so far.

Wyeast 2308, Whitelabs 833, Wyeast 2206 and Wyeast 2633. The 833 and 2206 are my preferred yeasts for this style, the 2308 was also good but I found it less malty and the 2633 was my least favorite however still reasonable.

Grist wise is simple as people have already stated, 50% Weyermann Munich2 and 50% pils malt do the job for me. I have brewed 1/3 Pils, Vienna and Munich2 and that was good but I love the results with the first grist.

Any noble hop for me as a bittering only addition for 25IBU's. Preferences are Hallertau or Tettnanger.

My opinion for what it's worth :ph34r:

C&B
TDA

#8 Barry

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 03:54 PM

Good Day
I love this style. I have a recipe that I am really happy with at oz.craftbrewer.org/Recipes
called Oscar Oktoberfest. This year's batch went well at Bathurst if you want independant evaluation. Unfortunately only had time to make one batch this winter due to a crook back and a couple weeks of flu.
Give it a go, you won't be be sorry. (and use the San Fran yeast, a great, easy to use, forgiving yeast for any malty lager style IMHO).

#9 Tony M

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 06:02 PM

The only problem you may have is the calender. The one I made last year in March took a good three months to reach its peak. For a long time I thought it very ordinary but was rewarded in the end. This years model I have yet to taste and I didnt start it until May.

#10 Steve

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 08:10 PM

TDA
I have 3 kilo of munich type 2 and 3 kilo of pils and was wondering what to do with it as ive never used it before :blink: thanks
:beer:
Steve

#11 Kai

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 10:38 PM

The only problem you may have is the calender. The one I made last year in March took a good three months to reach its peak.



Too easy, if your oky isn't ready in time then it's a maerzen, and vice versa.

#12 Voosher

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 11:12 PM


The only problem you may have is the calender. The one I made last year in March took a good three months to reach its peak.



Too easy, if your oky isn't ready in time then it's a maerzen, and vice versa.


And then of course there is the seasonal flip.
October in Germany is Autumn... equivalent of April here.
And March is Spring...
And rules are so often made to be broken.
:P
BREW. DRINK. ENJOY. Whenever.
:D

#13 Kai

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 11:47 PM

Is that where the vice versa comes in?

#14 Voosher

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 11:52 PM

Is that where the vice versa comes in?


Hmmmm.
I thought Maerzen meant March meaning brewed in March.
Oktoberfest... drunk in October.
Essentially the same style... with minor differences.
Could be wrong?
:huh:
May have to argue it over pint of said brew... when it's ready... :beer:

#15 Kai

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 12:11 AM

Hmmmm.
I thought Maerzen meant March meaning brewed in March.
Oktoberfest... drunk in October.
Essentially the same style... with minor differences.
Could be wrong?
:huh:
May have to argue it over pint of said brew... when it's ready... :beer:


Done! I'm sure we can find a venue too.

#16 THE DRUNK ARAB

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 09:52 AM

TDA
I have 3 kilo of munich type 2 and 3 kilo of pils and was wondering what to do with it as ive never used it before :blink: thanks
:beer:
Steve


Steve, as long as you have the capabilities to ferment at lager temps you should be fine. Try this:

50% Pils
50% Munich 2

Aim for an OG of 1052-54. I mash at 66C. And I use rainwater, if you do it may not hurt to add some nutrients to your boil 10 minutes from the end.

Do you have some noble German hops, Tettnanger or Hall or even Magnum or Northern Brewer? If so aim for a bittering addition to give 25IBU's. Boil for 90 minutes.

And use one of those yeasts I mentioned (WL 833 or Wy 2206), dry lager yeast will not cut the mustard here. Ferment at 10 to 11C for a minimum of 2 weeks, 3 would be better. Rack beer from yeast and lager for at least 3 weeks. Place in keg, carb up and enjoy.

Not blowing my trumpet but the above method/recipe did well in the SA state comp and the Nationals last year. Just so you know it can't be that bad ;)

Any other assistance, don't hesitate to ask.

C&B
TDA

#17 roach

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 11:20 AM

TDA,

What is your opinion on subbing the Wey Munich 2 for JW Dark Munich? I know the short answer would be go for the Wey Munich 2 as it will be a better beer, but will using JW Dark Munich instead, throw it completely off style and be an order of magnitude lesser beer?

I have a bag of the JW Dark Munich and heard some mixed reports if using it at up around 50% of the grain bill.

Also have some WL 833 and so might brew your award winning okky this weekend.

cheers
roach

#18 THE DRUNK ARAB

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 12:35 PM

TDA,

What is your opinion on subbing the Wey Munich 2 for JW Dark Munich? I know the short answer would be go for the Wey Munich 2 as it will be a better beer, but will using JW Dark Munich instead, throw it completely off style and be an order of magnitude lesser beer?

I have a bag of the JW Dark Munich and heard some mixed reports if using it at up around 50% of the grain bill.

Also have some WL 833 and so might brew your award winning okky this weekend.

cheers
roach

To be honest roach I have never tried the JW Dark Munich in any beer let alone an Oktoberfest. The short answer is correct :D !

Perhaps use 20 to 30% JW Dark Munich and 5 to 10% Melanoiden with the balance Pils malt? That is just a WAG but you can be the guinea pig here.

You know you wont go wrong with WL 833.

I could probably spare you 2 to 3 kilos of the Weyermann Munich 2 if you wish. I can even bring it to work tomorrow if you want to collect it?

C&B
TDA

#19 roach

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 01:49 PM

Will do the experiment TDA and use the JW Dark, so I won't need the Munich II but cheers anyway. Will have to do a blind tasting of the Wey v JW based okky's to get a more definitive view. Especially as I know some local brewers, whose palates are tainted just by mentioning a beer has JW dark munich in it.

#20 THE DRUNK ARAB

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Posted 23 October 2006 - 11:53 AM

Will do the experiment TDA and use the JW Dark, so I won't need the Munich II but cheers anyway. Will have to do a blind tasting of the Wey v JW based okky's to get a more definitive view. Especially as I know some local brewers, whose palates are tainted just by mentioning a beer has JW dark munich in it.


roach, did you get this beer brewed? How is it shaping up with the JW Dark Munich?

Just tapped my Oktoberfest yesterday, tasting quite nice. Used some Hallertau for flavouring and it has come through nicely.

C&B
TDA